Alan, I didn't say, nor did I mean to imply, that Fred's reasoning was not
valid. To the contrary, I think his reasoning is quite understandable, and I
have no problem with that part of his response. 

I was disappointed in his, seemingly, disinterest in pursuing this issue
with us to see if there is really an access problem with is site, and if
there is, his, seemingly, disinterest in working with us to examine possible
alternatives for resolving it. This may not be what he meant to convey, and
it might just be the way I, personally, perceived the tone and wording of
his message, but nevertheless, that is how it came across to me.  

In addition, I took the immediate action that I did to move us from
complaining about it to doing something about it. I don't believe in
complaining unless you are prepared to offer a solution. 

At this point, my impression is that the solution is first, for all of us to
be registered and to log into the QRZ site with a user ID and password. This
is a very simple and easy process, and it seems to solve our access issues.
In addition, I also commend Fred in the way he handles the capcha problem,
i.e. giving us a very easy math question. This is excellent, and I wish all
site designers dealt with the capcha this way. 

However, for other screen reader users that are not on this list or for
whatever reason, don't realize that they need to log into the site with a
user ID and password to gain full access, then, it appears that Fred would
help all screen reader users by placing a statement to that effect
prominently on the top of the index page of his site. 

Yes, I understand he is making such a statement which is a general statement
to all users, but I suggest that he be more specific with a statement such
as:

Note: it is especially important for blind and low-vision users who are
using screen reader programs, such as JAWS or WindowEyes, to register and
log into this site with a user ID and password for full use and ease of
navigation.

I have talked to some of you and conducted my own tests and found the above
steps seems to completely resolve our access issues. Again, I think Fred has
done an excellent job with the QRZ website. It is easy for those of us who
use screen reading programs to register, to log-in, and once this is done,
it is easy to navigate the site with a screen reading program. I am
especially impressed with the way he solves the capcha issue for us by
presenting it as a math question, not a graphic that we cannot see with our
screen reading programs. 

73,
Ron, K8HSY
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Alan R. Downing [mailto:[log in to unmask]] 
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 11:45 PM
To: [log in to unmask]; [log in to unmask]
Subject: RE: QRZ.COM accessibility

Hello again all,

Fred raises a valid point.  Look, the fact that Fred is a friend has nothing
to do with my position or feelings about how qrz.com does, or doesn't work.
One of the main reasons, and perhaps the only reason, that many sites
require that the user type in a graphically presented term, is to prevent
automated access to the site for deriving email and such.  Another thing is
that I do not regard the need to log into qrz.com a hindrance or problem.
This is a trivial requirement.  As I, and at least one other list member
said, it takes literally a few seconds to log in and then go about your
business.

I certainly remain willing and anxious to lend my assistance if asked, but I
take Fred's response to be valid.

Best 73


Alan R. Downing
Phoenix, AZ

-----Original Message-----
From: For blind ham radio operators [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
On Behalf Of Dr. Ronald E. Milliman
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 9:20 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: QRZ.COM accessibility

Below my message here is Fred's response to my post. Frankly, I am a bit
disappointed in his reply. My impression is that he is not especially
interested in working with us to find a mutually satisfactory solution to
the QRZ access issues. I expected him to possibly reject my suggestion, but
I thought he would come back and leave the door open for additional feedback
and suggestions if our initial one was not acceptable, but that is not how I
am perceiving his response. So, this is going to require a little more
thought in terms of what our next move should be. I'm going to work with the
site a little more myself. Since some of you are having no problems and some
are having considerable problems, it seems logical that we step back and ask
the question:

 

What are some of us doing differently than others, resulting in some of us
having more or less difficulty accessing the QRZ site. 

 

I suspect it might be as simple as those who are not having access issues
are logging into the site with a user ID and Password while those who are
experiencing problems are not. If, indeed, it is this simple, then, we can
take a little different approach with Fred and probably gain his full
cooperation.

 

So, is anyone here still having problems accessing QRZ.COM even if you use
your user ID and password? Of course, we are referring to only screen reader
users. 

 

Ron, K8HSY

 

From: Fred Lloyd [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 10:46 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: QRZ.COM accessibility

 

Ron,

There are circumstances which make it difficult for me to openly advertise a
text-only version of the site.   The facility, by the way, only serves
callsign lookups and the raw data.   It does not handle any forums or
biography material.

When the callsign data is made openly available to text readers, people
start abusing the site and writing programs to take advantage of an "open
door" into our database.   This activity subverts our subscription stream
which in turn could cause substantial harm to our company.    It's a sad
fact of life.

The system we now have in place requires word-of-mouth dissemination and
each member must be individually authorized by QRZ management to use the
feature.  

73,

-fred

On 8/23/2013 9:58 PM, Dr. Ronald E. Milliman wrote:

Fred,

 

First, I commend you for an excellent website, QRZ.COM. It is, indeed, one
of the most premier sites on the internet for hams.

 

However, there is one segment of hams, actually a rather large segment, that
are experiencing significant challenges when trying to access your site.
Those of us who are blind and use screen reading programs, like JAWS and
WindowEyes, are having problems accessing QRZ.COM. I understand that you
have a Text-based alternative that is more accessible. Unfortunately, not
very many of my blind colleagues are aware of this more accessible
alternative. Toward the objective of resolving this problem, I recommend
that you simply put a link on the top of your landing page, your index page,
something like:

 

For Screen Reader Users, Click Here

 

To make it even easier, it would be good if this entire wording be the link;
so, no matter where the screen reader user clicks on this link, it will take
him/her over to the text alternative of your site. 

 

Fred, my intent is to help you with this issue and offer a possible solution
for my blind ham colleagues. We are ready and willing to assist you any way
we can to resolve this issue. If needed, we are fully prepared to form a
small group or committee of blind hams to work with you and help any way we
can. Just let us know if we can assist you any further with this matter.

 

73,

Ron, K8HSY

 

 





--
Fred Lloyd, AA7BQ
President and Founder, QRZ.COM
[log in to unmask]
http://www.qrz.com/db/aa7bq