Carol,
Welcome to the list!
I had asked if anyone thought grains are "natural"...
And you said:
> I strongly believe that they are not. I base this belief mostly
> on two arguments: 1) in their original state, most grains are hard,
> spikey, nasty little plants that don't exactly make a person's
> mouth water, and 2) there is much evidence linking grains to
> various diseases (MS, celiac, arthritis, etc.) and I think it
> unlikely that such a link only exists for cooked grains.
I have thought the same thing basically.
> > However, is this also the case to any degree with raw soaked
> > grains? ...Are grains a natural food for us?
>
> "Natural" is such a tricky word, isn't it? Is is natural to soak
> grains at all? Is it natural to sprout? One could take the side
> that since we have brains that could think of these things, and
> since our brains are a natural part of us, then these things are
> natural. Maybe, but then it isn't much of a leap to go from there
> to saying that rayon and nuclear power plants are natural for the
> same reasons. My personal opinion on the matter is pretty much in
> line with that of the anopsological folks -- the more you have to
> mess with it to make it palatable, the less likely you should be
> eating it in the first place. The simple fact that there are
> vitamins and minerals in grains is meaningless, especially when you
> consider that hemlock has plenty of vitamins and minerals too! :D
Yes, pretty much my thoughts there too... Are raw soaked grains natural?
Is Mt. Rushmore natural? Is the Empire State Building natural? Is a clay
pot natural? Is using a walking stick natural? Is wearing clothing
natural? etc... We are humans with big brains, so maybe in that context,
grains ARE natural (to eat)?! But things I've read, seem to indicate no,
not even raw..But I am not certain of this.
I have now been without use of raw soaked grains for 2 days now, and I
must say, I think I've had some mucus clear up...Had been eating raw
soaked oat groats, in moderation...I think I can correlate the mucus
with the grains, but it's premature to speculate yet...But I seem to
feel different in other ways too, including mentally...I have read about
the opioids in grains and supposed psychoactive effects, behavioral
effects, etc., and that is intriguing, and may have some basis in
reality!
Also, after I had went 100% raw, I was feeling great...until I tried
some soaked oat groats, and felt brought down, somewhat spaced out and
depressed, weakened, etc.. I thought it could be the grains, but I kept
eating them every day and eventually felt better...but now after I've
quit them, I'm feeling better than I did with them...coughed up quite a
bit of mucus yesterday during a run, first day "grain free"...We'll see
what happens as time goes on!
Ratha,
> The other day on the web I stumbled upon a testimonial
> for bread-type foods made from fermented, rather than
> baked, dough. The claim was that the grain was more
> digestible and more appealing as a result. It occurred
> to me over the weekend how interesting I think this is
> and so I have spent all day today looking for the
> reference but with no success. Has anyone by chance
> seen it or anything similar?
Actually, the digestibility isn't the main factor...Simple cooked boiled
grains are very digestible...The main factor here is what happens when
grains and grain products are metabolized.. That is what I'm trying to
figure out here..If there is more harm than good, or at least, if grains
are a non-optimal food and something that is best not eaten.. (Seeing as
how I'm fortunate enough to have a choice, unlike many of the world's
starving people, who would be very grateful to have all the grains they
could handle, and could care less about opioids, gluten, mucus,
psychoactive effects, and so on).
> I know of one place on the web that sells raw oat
> groats. Does anyone know where to find other grains
> like millet and kamut and buckwheat, raw? I'm guessing
> it's safe to assume that any grain is steamed or
> heat-processed unless otherwise labeled?
The grains available via Sunorganic Farm - http://www.sunorganic.com -
are raw, including the oat groats.
> So on another note, my curiosity has become piqued
> about different types of grain. I had been told some
> time ago that buckwheat is not actually grain, that it
> is botanically a fruit, although I don't know how
> reliable that info is. I also found this essay at the
> Price-Pottenger Foundation
> (http://www.price-pottenger.org/Articles/quinoa.html)
> which says, "Although Quinoa is thought of as a grain,
> this annual herb is technically a fruit of the
> chenopodium family."
Yes, some grains, and other foods as well, are technically fruits.
However, they are still realistically grains. Even nuts are technically
fruits. So, if we broaden our definition of fruitarianism, many people
are actually fruitarians without even trying!
> Since I have been mostly paleo for the past year part
> of me says "no!!" - but the fact that grain is eaten
> by almost every culture, including robust and
> long-lived ones like the Hunzas, to me is a persuasive
> argument. I personally would not use less than the
> whole grain, because of the loss of nutrients when it
> is refined, as well as the loss of bulk, which makes
> it easier to overeat.
Yes, the Hunzas and other cultures come to mind with grain usage, and
also dairy usage. The Bulgarians have been also documented to live a
long time (many centenarians) and consume lots of raw dairy.
Then again, there are SAD-eating centenarians..:)
Wes
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