Hi Jean-Louis

> > On which basis do you hold this view? There are quite a number of
> > pure fruitarians in Germany (often the "patients" of Helmut
> > Wandmaker in our group, for one) who not only live but also thrive on this
> > diet. Readers letters in our journal undermine this. Leaving aside
> > vitamin B12 (a deficiency of which none of the fruitarians reports
> > having) what do you feel is missing or low in this diet from the
> > point of view of nutrients? I am not a pure fruitarian BTW as I
> > can't afford to eat quality fruit each and every day from Orkos
> > etc.. I eat fruit only for breakfast and then nothing until around
> > 18:00 hrs (when eat eat raw veggies...and wild plants when in
> > season..dressed with a quality cold-pressed oil).
>
> I am not willing to discuss fruitarianism in depth, but here is my
> opinion:
>
>  -Fruitarianism can work fine, and even very well, for a few months
> or, if fruit is of very high quality, a few years.
>
Tom Billings also claims this..but there is no proof as yet
because quality fruit has not been on the market long enough..
and eaten alone long enough by enough people..to be able to make
such a statement. Chimps etc. still get along well with plenty of
fruit in comparison to the quantities of other things they eat.

>  -You said you have been eating raw for three years, so I guess you
> have been fruitarian for less than two years. Perhaps if you had stuck
> to the diet a little longer, deficiencies would have eventually
> appeared.
>
I have never been a fruitarian, I have been eating raw quality fruit
every day as part of my vegetarian diet for the past 10 years though.
I have been eating fruit and vegetables raw for the past three
years. If you want to talk to a successful fruitarian, talk to
Helmut Wandmaker in our group, or read his book "If you want to
be healthy, forget the cooking pots".

>  -The quality of fruit from Orkos is very high: that might have
> delayed deficiencies or dental problems.
>
Deficiencies in what? Dental problems from what?

>  -Many fruitarians are emaciated because fruitarianism is
> calorie-restricted (unless you eat large amounts of avocados and
> dates).

All the fruitarians I know are not emaciated, they carry their
natural weight (just as I do at 74 kg plus or minus 0.5 kg).
Over 50% of north Americans, for example, are classed as obese..
and to them most people of normal weight must appear emaciated.
As to calories, they have nothing to do with weight but more
to do with energy. And the simple sugars in fruit are an
excellent energy source (coupled with the fact that very
little digestive energy is needed to exploit them). People
do not put on excessive weight by eating too many calories,
but by eating the wrong foods. Any vegetarian who wishes to
hype up his or her consumption of nuts and other oily foods such
as avocados can find this out for themselves.

>You were not, but you said you used to be slightly overweight:
> people having a severe weight problem can eat very few calories and
> still be obese,

Exactly that Jean-Louis! You have hit the nail on the head. As
I said earlier, calories (or excessive calories) have nothing
to do with obesity.

> but those who are naturally thin become even thinner
> when they restrict calories.
>
Exactly. The body needs calories (i.e. energy) in order to
survive and thrive and build bones, muscle and tissue.

>  -People having written books on fruitarianism won't tell the truth if
> they "cheat" (i.e. don't stick to their diet) because if they say that
> their diet doesn't work, no one will buy their books, attend their
> lectures or seminars, etc.
>
I won't deny that there may be people like this around..because I
simply don't know. But they must be pretty poor wretches if they
make their living talking about something they don't believe in
or actually practise. One can lie to other people..and even make
money perhaps..but the burden of knowing that one is lying to
oneself must be intolerable.

>  -Even those who don't have any financial interest often don't even
> admit to _themselves_ that their diet doesn't work. One possible
> reason is their indoctrination (when one has read or heard many times
> that fruit is the only natural food for humans and anything else is
> toxic, it is hard to start thinking differently).

I agree entirely. Many things that people have "praised" have
not worked for me personally, for example. That is why I have
the (often irritating) habit of questioning just about everything
and everybody on some issues (even myself as well of course).

>Another possible
> reason is that it is hard to admit, after several years believing to
> have found the Truth and trying to propagate it, that all these ideas
> are worthless for the most part.
>
I (we) only have to admit that to ourselves Jean-Louis..and if you
cannot be honest to yourself then what is the point of living?
As to propagating, propagating is when you are selling something
for some sort of profit (and self-esteem may also be a "profit"
to some of course). I can not benefit from propagating my views
unless someone somewhere challenges them with a better argument
than I happen to have at that time and I gain a benefit from
trying out this new aspect for myself. Is this not the
objective of this list?

>  -This list is one of the very few places where people talk freely
> about their successes and failures. I have heard of many failures and
> very few successes on fruitarianism. Even Forest, who lives under
> ideal conditions (climate and fruit quality), eats no more than 70%
> fruit and feels the need to supplement with yeast, spirulina, liquid
> aminos, and add a "filler".
>
I can not speak for Forest (although I must admit I appreciate his
posts) and neither for the rest. Each has his/her own convictions
and beliefs and this is what makes any list tick.

Best regards,

Alan