<<Disclaimer: Verify this information before applying it to your situation.>> Dear Listmates, To carry on the "conversation" that TC started and Tami & Mara continued, I'd like to point out that what Tami said: "We are strictly a niche market...we have to give them a *business* reason to cooperate with us" is quite true, as well as Mara's comment that basically echoes the old saying that you can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. Mara said: "If I call a manufacturer and say "I'd like to know if there's any gluten or wheat in your product," they immediately become defensive. On the other hand, if I start by saying ""I have dietary restrictions and I'd like to know if it's safe for me to eat your product,"" they are usually eager to help." So perhaps if we all remember that when our "little" niche market being celiacs is added to the niche markets of all the other reasons people choose food according to ingredients labels for themselves and their families, and pass this information along to the companies, they will then see that they do, indeed, have a "business" reason to cooperate. And if we also remember to mention Mara's confidence that she shares that she needs to know that food is safe according to her dietary restrictions, I agree that we will gain assistance and awareness rather than defensiveness. It's too bad about Kelloggs' Kenmei cereal, but keeping in mind that not all of us on this list belong to an organized local celiac group and visa versa that not all "land" members of celiac groups are on this e-mail list, Kellogg's or any manufacturer has a heck of a job to market a product whose main attraction is to us. Now if only we had a national or international proactive campaign in full swing right now --- composed of all the niche market groups of consumers ---- to assist manufacturers and governments in making a decision to provide full disclosure product labelling, without exception. We've got the energy, we just need the direction. I'll pass the soapbox to someone else now. Helen in Vancouver, BC