<<Disclaimer: Verify this information before applying it to your situation.>> >Bill Elkus raised a fascinating point below about the possibility of creating >an independent lab. Might Don Kasarda or Joe Murray have an idea about how >much $$ it might cost to set up and maintain one at a university? George Balch asked if I could estimate the cost of a testing lab for products. It is somewhat difficult because the cost would depend on the situation. For example, will the site (university?) eat the cost of laboratory space and equipment, or will that have to be provided. Will the work be carried out by addition of one or two people to an existing unit, or will an independent operation be set up. That sort of thing. I would guess that a minimal amount would be around $100,000 per year. Long term funding would, of course, be desirable. A Ph.D.-level scientist worth anything will expect a salary somewhere between $35,000 and $60,000 per year depending on background and experience (even more for the very best with highly pertinent experience). M.S. level people will cost only slightly less. B.S. level people will be paid in the $20,000 to $40,000 range, but would usually serve mainly as assistants. B.S. level people in science are usually not qualified to operate independently (obviously there are be major exceptions to this; there is no magic in a degree at any level), because many of the better graduates at the bachelor's level have tended to go on for advanced degrees during the past few decades as a consequence of abundant teaching and research assistantships for science graduate students. Also, it is difficult to hire decently-trained scientific people for short terms. Good people who have sweated through 4-10 years of university education in scientific fields are seldom willing to work for six months here and six months there. Adaptation to new work is often slow for people who have been working in another area--months, sometimes years, depending on the techniques to be used, how difficult the problem to be addressed is, and the background of the person involved. In my area, which is largely involved with understanding the fundamental molecular structure of gluten proteins, their interactions, and the implications of both for wheat quality (and celiac disease), I have found that even very good new Ph. D.'s take 2-5 years to approach solid understanding of the area, to become at ease with the many different techniques we use, and to develop a capablity to contribute independently. One could argue with almost every point I have brought up, but my own feeling is that if the effort is too much based on a shoestring level of funding, you will probably not get the quality of output that is desired. Some of the problems with products are difficult to address. A major one is that manufacturers often buy ingredients from the cheapest sources, which often change month by month. One source may have a gluten-free ingredient, while the next one may not. Often the ingredient manufacturers are protective of their information and will not tell the next-stage manufacturer how they made the product or what ingredients were involved in the process (for example, was the source of a particular enzyme a crude, malted barly extract, or was it bioengineered product from bacteria?). Consequently, even with good will, a very large manufacturer will often have difficulty saying if the product is gluten-free or not. And even though such large companies could contract for gluten-free ingredients, this would cost them money and I doubt the celiac market is sufficient to recompense them for this. Hope this isn't too far off what George Balch wanted to know. Don Kasarda