H,
I find that statement ridiculously funny since it's a primo example of False Advertisement. My example is, however, true.
My strategies on getting your brand spanking new credit card in my possession are pioneer and thus, so far, the best strategies thought of by a woman, in her sleep.
Chris
--- On Sun, 2/12/12, Haruna <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
From: Haruna <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [G_L] I could not have found a better project for you Hairy
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Sunday, February 12, 2012, 10:58 PM
And what do you find ridiculously funny about that statement??????????????????
Well I love you too. Why can't you make a hit single like Adele or Taylor Swift?? Who cares if nobody buys it? I'll buy it. Something tells me you have a great voice.
Haruna.
-----Original Message-----
From: Halima Sukuna <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sat, Feb 11, 2012 4:55 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] I could not have found a better project for you Hairy
Well H,
If the big red nose fits, so be it. I can't help that you throw ridiculously funny comments into your conversations.
" I must say though that my positions on abortion and sexuality are pioneer and the most valuable positions so far expressed by man."
All I see are the big red shoes, the bright red plastic nose and a flower that squirts water.
Chris
--- On Wed, 2/8/12, Haruna <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
From: Haruna <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [G_L] I could not have found a better project for you Hairy
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Wednesday, February 8, 2012, 8:57 PM
Ky, this clown school thing is lame and kinda old. I remembered during Caesar's Rome, the clowns were the indigent of religion and were the first targets of the clergy.
Anyway, at least you don't have to pay for my act. It is free for you. Au gratis. No clown school would do that for you. When sober folk discuss religion and circumstance, it is expected that those in our audience are actually capable of synthesizing the information. Now git before you piss me off. I only read the first sentence of your forward to realize it is cacamayme.
Haruna. I love you people.
-----Original Message-----
From: Halima Sukuna <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wed, Feb 8, 2012 5:50 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] I could not have found a better project for you Hairy
Darbs,
I just love it when I get the yummiest of ideas for wayward folks. Take a look. It's right up your alley!
http://www.nygoofs.com/register-now
Later turkey,
Chris
--- On Tue, 2/7/12, Baba Galleh Jallow <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
From: Baba Galleh Jallow <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
To: [log in to unmask]
Date: Tuesday, February 7, 2012, 9:51 PM
#yiv740730301 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_5888b392-0b47-4a80-87d4-32f79f60d814 td{color:black;}#yiv740730301 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_5888b392-0b47-4a80-87d4-32f79f60d814 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_cde8458e-e5a3-46f1-b43e-9378939d4b0a td{color:black;}#yiv740730301 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_5888b392-0b47-4a80-87d4-32f79f60d814 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_cde8458e-e5a3-46f1-b43e-9378939d4b0a .yiv740730301hmmessage P {margin:0px;padding:0px;}#yiv740730301 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_5888b392-0b47-4a80-87d4-32f79f60d814 #yiv740730301AOLMsgPart_1_cde8458e-e5a3-46f1-b43e-9378939d4b0a body.yiv740730301hmmessage {font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma;}
Haruna, if my question had an uncustomary tone, it was not intended. So please forgive me for that. I am the same old Galleh with the same love for customary tolerance and respect for differing opinion. No paradigm intended . And as you know Haruna, I also absolutely love the unconventional, so no apologies there either. I now understand your idea of HarunaSilo as religion but not cult. I think it was nicely put in your earlier email as Lakum Dinukum Waliya Deen. That's exactly my position too. Thanks for the kind clarification.
On your personal email, I have not seen it yet. Did you send it to this email address?
Baba
Date: Tue, 7 Feb 2012 22:00:46 -0500
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
To: [log in to unmask]
Galleh, the uncustomary tone of your question scared me a bit. I thought I said or did something wrong.
Just so I stay focused and am responsive to your question, I'll go directly to it:
[-----Original Message-----
From: Baba Galleh Jallow <[log in to unmask]> To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Tue, Feb 7, 2012 5:18 pm Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
Haruna, Do I understand you saying that all religions are cult but that HarunaSilo, your own religion, is not cult?] Galleh.
Close Galleh. I said ALL ORGANIZED RELIGION is OCCULT. ALL organized religions are by definition CULTS.
My religion, HarunaSilo, like your religion BabaSilo are ours and ours only. They are true religions. They are not CULTS. However, when they are purveyed for our fellow man/woman to adopt as their own religion and we have more than ourselves in the religion, they WILL become CULTS. And I shared that when HarunaSilo is adopted by any indigent of religion or who has not discovered his/her religion yet, then HarunaSilo will cease to become my religion. I will head-off OCCULT. The idea is that when I share HarunaSilo with folk, it is intended to inspire them to discover their own religion and therefore preclude adopting HarunaSilo as their religion. They do not have the same conversations or experience with DaarManso as Haruna does. That is why when you are inspired by the Paradigm of HarunaSilo, you will be inclined to found BabaSilo.
I took this much time Galleh because you have spurred a very important conversation about spirituality and salvation. I must make sure I am not misunderstood.
[Just wanted to be sure.] Galleh.
Well there you go Galleh.
[Looking forward to your personal email.] Galleh.
Unlike Layen, you must have by now received my private mail to you. I hope my answers here do not hurt me with you because I really need your advice and suggestions. Galleh, you don't even know the hate mail I get when I pronounce positions on religion and circumstance. Your query is nothing compared to what I have coming at me. So if its any consolation, please forgive my unconventional positions on religion. I must say though that my positions on abortion and sexuality are pioneer and the most valuable positions so far expressed by man. Only a HarunaMo or a BabaMo can see these oft-controversial issues clearly Galleh.
I Look forward to hearing from you Galleh. Suntou I don't wanna hear it about friggin Islam and Ky don't even think about it about Christianity.
Haruna.
Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 16:27:37 -0500
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
To: [log in to unmask]
Aye Aye Galleh. I do not and will never expect you to call Mouridism, Niasseny, Islam, Mormonism, Christianity, or other permutations thereof Occult just yet. That will be inconsiderate and callous of me. I respect that you have voluntarily chosen Islam as BabaSilo. We never know what further living might yield. I know organized religion to be tradition purveyed through ritual and festivity to commemorate the religion of other.
HarunaSilo is Haruna's religion. It is not compatible with another fellow citizen anywhere. It is my manner of worship through my experiences, dreams, revelations (education), and conversations with DaarManso. I will develop rituals appropriately to mark those episodes of DaarManso's reverence. I will share them for educational purposes only. When I begin to purvey HarunaSilo as religion for other, to replace their own, either through force, benevolent coercion, bribery, gamble, or deceit, HarunaSilo will cease to be my religion and will become a cult, just like the other organized religions. Should anyone be interested or inspired by the PARADIGM of HarunaSilo, they are free to fashion their religion thusly and name it KySilo, BabaSilo, SuntouSilo, GiuseppeSilo, or LayeSilo.
I do not demand that my own children adopt HarunaSilo as they develop their own religions. I do nurture them in consideration of their fellow citizens and when they reach the ages of maturity, they will be free to worship their DaarManso/God/Allah/other as they desire, within the strictures of community law. Should any community law be based on any cult, including their own, that runs roughshod to the fundamental human rights of their fellow, they are encouraged to challenge such law.
This in the spirit of Lakum Deenikum walyadeen. It supposes voluntary adoption of religion.
In the meantime, for the indigent of religion and for those who haven't discovered their religions yet, I recommend associating themselves with any of the cults available to them and to adopt those cults as their religions.
Galleh, I do have a personal question to ask of you and I shall convey that privately. I would appreciate any suggestion you may have in that regard.
Thank you again for value-conversation.
Haruna. HarunaMo. Of HarunaSilo.
-----Original Message-----
From: Baba Jallow <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Feb 5, 2012 5:45 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
Comprehensive response Haruna. Your defintion and explication of cult is certainly convincing and I appreciate your taking the time to be so thorough. Perhaps, it is the pejorative connotation of the English word cult that makes me refuse to call the Mouride and the Niassene cults. As you rightly say, cult is always the other. I would rather go with the Mouride and Niassene as parts of the Sufi and Tijaniyya Ways, which in turn, are part of the religion Islam, to which I belong. Please forgive me for not calling Islam a cult. So Brother, I respectfully suppose that we are going to have to agree to disagree at least over this one particular issue. I too, look for further education on HarunaSilo and other cults in this big wide world. Thanks for a great conversation.
Baba
On Sun, Feb 5, 2012 at 2:13 PM, Haruna <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Sorry Galleh I did not receive this response of yours. It is significant as to definitions and value so I'll share some ideas on it:
-------original message-------
[Subject:
Re: Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
From:
Baba Galleh Jallow <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:
GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Date:
Fri, 3 Feb 2012 20:18:25 -0800Great response Haruna. Thanks a lot. I would beg to differ, however, on your characterization of the Mouride and the Niassene as cults. Of course, we can choose to call them what we want depending on our particular orientations; and I fully respect your right to so call them if you wish.] Galleh.
Yes Galleh thank you for the acknowledgement and consideration.
Generally, and in more public discourse, I avoid injecting my personal orientation and desire when the matter at hand has some educative and or informative value. Most English dictionaries define Cult as "a system of religious worship particularly when the worship is conducted in ritual, a devotion or homage to person or thing". It follows then that all organized religions of the world - Zoroastrianism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Mormonism, Bahai, etcetera and their various permutations are therefore cults. I agree with the English dictionary's definition of CULT that is why I describe all organized religion as occult. The meaning of English words morph as time and traditions march on and dictionaries are often adapted to reflect this dynamism. When meaning of a word changes fundamentally as in the case of cult, for example if a religion or any of its permutations changes tradition fundamentally, the adaptation is completed by changing the
word used to describe the new regime. Organized religions generally view the word cult with some disdain and trepidation but because this is exactly how they all began and continue to operate, there is no escaping the word. To get around the stain, you will see some organized religions brand other religions as cults in order to manufacture some sanctity for their own but that doesn't hold much water for the English language. This is because language is a tool for expression and is not biased as to tradition. If I were speaking Mandingo, I would call organized relion Aadolu. What I share is that the word itself is not pejorative. It is in what the word describes that we can infer a pejorative and that we can only accomplish by the context surrounding the word or the sum total of activity that warrants the use of the word.
[However, in my humble opinion, both the Mouride and the Niassene are of larger religious geneologies that do not fit the cult characterization,] Galleh.
I see. However, and as you admit, the Mouride and Niassene traditions are offshoots of in your words - Larger religious genealogies. Genealogy only describes regime of propagation. I take it therefore that Mouridism and Niasseny are both derivative of another organized religion.
[namely, the Sufi and Tijaniyya Ways respectively, which in turn, are part of the larger Islam as paradigm.] Galleh.
Galleh I will share here that I adore conversation with you for you enlarge discussion for vitality and you bend over backwards sometimes just to be comprehensively nice. There's much to be said for such benign despensation. When I become Secretary general of the UN, I will make you my special envoy to Senegal. You shared here that Sufism and Tijaniyya silos (ways) are paths of some larger Silo (way - Islam), and that the larger way is a Paradigm, a regime or pattern of expression, if you will. A cult is a paradigm, and the Tijaniyya and Sufi ways originated from a singular person. The two ways are replete with ritual as manner of expressing devotion, and they both carry the actual names of their founders.
[To my mind a cult stands alone and is a complete unit unto itself; similar perhaps, but essentially different from other cults.] Galleh.
Galleh, this is what I mean by your self-deprecating humility. If you say a cult stands alone you do not share its constitution. In other words, a group of people gathered for prayer at the mosque stands alone from another group of people who gather for prayer in a church. The two are however groups of people. It is the manner of prayer that Cult connotes. The reason why you admit some similarity between the cults that "stand alone" and those cults that may not stand alone is because you are restricted by the meaning of the word cult. I will offer you an opportunity to found a new English word that describes those CULTS that are capable of standing alone as opposed to those that are not Galleh.
[Both the Mouride and Niassene are inextricably embedded within larger religious formations that in turn are embedded within Islam.] Galleh.
Yes Galleh. And because I am only curious, what are some of the other cults that are different from Mouridism and Niasseny as to warrant the name cult?
[For this reason, I would not call them cults.] Galleh.
I understand Galleh.
[But again, this is just me disagreeing with you on this point.] Galleh
I understand and I appreciate the divergence. Some day when I meet with you Galleh, I will query you on BabaSilo. Now that is NOT a CULT. Because it is not an organized religion.
[You have a good night too!! Cheers, Baba] Galleh.
Aye Aye Galleh. Thank you for the conversation in cults. I look forward to greater education.
-----Original Message-----
From: Haruna <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Fri, Feb 3, 2012 10:39 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
Indeed Galleh on the value of the Mouride cult to Wade. The idea for the Niassene cult is to shame the mouride cult into propriety. Now whether or not folk who are predisposed to misinterpret shame as humility will ever be shamed is another story totally. But the general objective can be achieved with or without either cult. There is some hope for erstwhile rehabilitation however and I intend to seize those glimpses of hope.
Forgive me. I get all my Senegal news from Sudonline newspaper. I have a permanent link to it at www.thegdp.org. Thank you for reminding me. As you indicated, even though I mainly share Sudonline stories about Senegal, I always endeavor to accord courtesy to that source at the beginning of my stories. This was an oversight and I commend you for reminding me. This is extremely important. I think all of us should develop this attitude. Whenever you see me omit giving credit and or source, please bring it to my attention. Because not only is it valuable for future research/ers, there is a fine line between plagiarism, theft of intellectual property, and merely passing along information. It is always best to bear on caution and propriety.
Thank you again Galleh. Good to hear you again.
Haruna.
-----Original Message-----
From: Baba Galleh Jallow <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Fri, Feb 3, 2012 6:57 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
Haruna,
Actually, I think there's only one person who can successfully ask Wade to step down, and he's the head of a religious order. I think if the Calipha of the Mourides asks him to step down today, he will because he is a staunch disciple of the Mouride.
Also, I wanted to suggest that it would be great if you could kindly remember to include the source for these great stories just in case one desires to cite them someday. I know you do it sometimes.
Thanks for sharing.
Baba
Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2012 14:47:48 -0500
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [G_L] Senegal: Khalif General of The Niassene Order implores Wade to withdraw from presidential contest.
To: [log in to unmask]
You know if the idiots would listen to anyone, it's be the equally clueless religious orders.
LEONA NIASSENE
La famille exhorte Wade à quitter le pouvoir
Publié le 01/02/2012 | 03H16 GMT par Omar DIAW
Mohamed Niass, fils d'Ibrahima Niasse, khalife de Léona Niasséne, a demandé au Président Abdoulaye Wade de se démettre de ses fonctions de Chef de l'Etat et de ne pas se présenter à l'élection présidentielle de 2012. Il déclare parler au nom du khalife de Léona Niasséne, sur les ondes de la Télévision Walf Fadjri, quelques heures après la dispersion musclée de la manifestation contre la candidature de Me Wade à la présidentielle de 2012.
« Après 12 ans, nous demandons au Président Abdoulaye Wade de quitter le pouvoir et de rendre la démission avant l'aube.
Le pouvoir ne vaut plus que la vie des hommes », a déclaré en substance le représentant de la famille de Léona Niasséne, la voix étreinte par l'émotion.
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