You mean I can apear to kill someone and it is ok if I think it is iok between God and I. -- Christ is either Lord of all or he is not Lord at all. Karen Carter '74 > I know this. This is why I was saying that we can not judge whether or not > one is a good Christian witness by the way he lives his life as all > Christians are imperfectly living their lives and in most cases it is > condoned. I am guilty of living an imperfect life myself so whatever this > couple does if they feel it is rite in the sight of god they should do it > without really worrying over how it may appear too others. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "virgie underwood" <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 10:42 AM > Subject: Re: question, problem, and prayer request. > > > > Angel, > > When I was attending a Catholic church, they use to have a Sunday morning > > breakfast. > > There is a school attached to the church, but still, we had breakfast and > > there were soft drink machines there also. > > My point is that Catholics and Protestants both are doing the same thing. > > I have a big enough job taking care of my business and keeping my nose > > clean that I do not have time to worry about those small things. > > When we meet Jesus face to face, he will know what is in our hearts and I > > do not believe that we will be judged by whether we are drinking soft > > drinks from the vending machine, or drinking coffee from a coffee pot. > > I believe we will be judged according to what is in our hearts, and how we > > have treated our each other. > > Just my thoughts. > > Blessings to all! > > Virgie At 08:48 AM 7/21/2005, you wrote: > > > > >I know Christian people who are gluttons as well. Just look at all the > fat > > >people in the church. Do I judge them? Gluttony is a sin according to > St > > >Paul. The body is the temple of the holy spirit and I know Christians > who > > >drink soft drinks. If a soft drink can clean the porcelain off a toilet > > >bole I know I wouldn't want to drink it. I even went to a Christian > church > > >where there was a soft drink machine in the basement of the church of all > > >things. The take drugs as well. They are always drinking caffeine. I > say > > >that to say this just what is a good witness. I really don't think we > can > > >really say what is a good witness for Christ when there are so many > > >Christian hypocrites around who do not practice what they preach. There > are > > >a lot of male female room mates who aren't either having sex together or > > >contemplating marriage. If people are basing their relationship with > Christ > > >on merely looking at how people around them live and not on their > personal > > >relationship with Christ they will be building their house on shifting > sands > > >and it will fall. ----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Brad D" <[log in to unmask]> > > >To: <[log in to unmask]> > > >Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 7:47 AM > > >Subject: Re: question, problem, and prayer request. > > > > > > > > > > Do we have a godly biblical example of living together before > marriage? It > > > > is always best, prudent and wise to bring our situations back to > scripture > > > > no matter how it might cut cross grain to us. Their may be situations > > > > today that may not have existed then, but come to think of it not all > that > > > > many. In any event giving the appearance of evil is not only a concern > for > > > > ourselves, in our own conern of what people may think, but also that > of > > > > all Christians. What if you tried witnessing to a non-believer and > they > > > > said "Don't talk to me about being high and mighty or living > righteous, I > > > > know a christian couple who lived together before marriage, how does > that > > > > differ from non-Christians today?". You see we bare the responsibility > of > > > > wearing Christ-like across our chest when we are known as such, and > > > > appearing as non-believers with a live-in situation doesn't seem to > line > > > > up biblically or doing as the Word says, to stay away from even the > > > > appearance of sin, not to mention surposefully put ourselves in > > > > temptations way no matter how strong we feel our faith is. Psalms 1 > says > > > > > > > > Ps 1:1-2 > > > > Blessed is the man who does not walk in the counsel of the wicked or > stand > > > > in the way of sinners > > > > or sit in the seat of mockers. But his delight is in the law of the > LORD, > > > > and on his law he meditates day and night. > > > > > > > > Notice the progression of "walk", "stand" and "sit" it cannotes a > gradual > > > > decline if allowed to entertain the ideals of ideals working against > the > > > > law or God's Word. > > > > > > > > I saw a message somewhere about if one gives in to a principle as such > > > > now, how that might affect futre decisoins and ect. I agree. What > would > > > > make a couple stronger, living together because of life's > circumstances > > > > or arranging other means until that day when no holds are preventing a > > > > couple of living as a married one. > > > > > > > > Brad > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > on 02:47 AM 7/21/2005, Angel said: > > > > I agree with you. It seems Christians today think the devil is bound > to > > > > win > > > > in every situation. I think if you do live together without falling > in to > > > > sin it will prove to you more than anything else your love for each > other > > > > is > > > > not based on mere physical attraction but instead is a heavenly godly > love > > > > which will last through the years. It will also serve as a testament > of > > > > your commitment to god's precepts. I will pray that you be constant > in > > > > this > > > > commitment which I know you will and that your marriage will last as > long > > > > as > > > > the firm foundation on which it will be built which is Christ. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Jenifer Barr" <[log in to unmask]> > > > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 9:36 PM > > > > Subject: Re: question, problem, and prayer request. > > > > > > > > > > > > > what is a vow between god and two people? If we have vowed before > God > > > > and > > > > > each other that sex will not occur until marriage, then why is > living > > > > > together a sin? We are not intimate until then. I understand > about > > > > > temptation but that's when you pray every day that God keeps you > > > > strong. > > > > > > > > > > Our situation is unique and it's not like we haven't prayed about > > > > it. I > > > > > guess I'm just hurt because everyone seems to think that just > because > > > > we're > > > > > going to be living together the devel is going to win. God is the > only > > > > one > > > > > in control. Is this our ideal situation? no. I've been through > too > > > > much > > > > > in the past to know what temptation can do to someone... and i... > or > > > > yet > > > > > we... will not break our vow before god. > > > > > > > > > > Jenifer Barr. > > > > > When the trumpet blows... I'm outta here! > > > > > AIM: jenibear1998 > > > > > msn > > > > > [log in to unmask] > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Kathy Du Bois" <[log in to unmask]> > > > > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 2:06 PM > > > > > Subject: Re: question, problem, and prayer request. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hey Jen, > > > > > > First of all, I'm sorry that you are dealing with an > > > > inflexible > > > > > > pastor. I don't see what difference it makes to him whether the > > > > cerimony > > > > > > is big or small, before or after the civil cerimony. I suppose > that > > > > he > > > > is > > > > > > standing on something for theological reasons, but I have no clue > > > > what > > > > > > that > > > > > > would be. It seems to me that you are left with three > > > > options: switch > > > > > > pastors, move the wedding up, or leave things as they are and > trust > > > > God > > > > > > for a miracle. As a child of God, the one option that you don't > > > > have, > > > > is > > > > > > to move in together. If you begin your marriage by compromising > > > > your > > > > > > principles on something that is truly small in the grand scheme > of > > > > > > things, > > > > > > how can you be trusted for the bigger ones. Believe me, the one > > > > thing > > > > > > that > > > > > > I am learning about our heavenly Father is that he is extremely > > > > creative > > > > > > in > > > > > > the solution department. We often miss it because we get so > stuck in > > > > > > thinking that the only solutions available to us are the ones > that we > > > > can > > > > > > see and we shut the door on His creativity. This is a test. > This is > > > > only > > > > > > a test. The question is, will you trust Him and wait for His > > > > solution > > > > and > > > > > > timing or will you continue to see with earthly eyes only what is > > > > > > possible. Good luck on your adventure. He is faithful. Your > task > > > > is > > > > to > > > > > > remain patient and at peace! GRIN! > > > > > > Kathy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At 05:17 PM 7/18/2005, you wrote: > > > > > >>Hi all. As most of you know, i am getting married in november. > I > > > > found > > > > > >>out > > > > > >>today from work that they want me to transfer in the beginning of > > > > august. > > > > > >>I > > > > > >>can't tell them i won't transfer then because it is the end of > our > > > > fiscal > > > > > >>year august 31 and i could forfit my job. Problem is though, > that my > > > > > >>fiancee and I decided that to save money... if i had to move in > > > > september > > > > > >>or > > > > > >>october we would just live together until the wedding. We both > don't > > > > > >>really > > > > > >>like the idea but it's like we have no choice. I don't know what > to > > > > do. > > > > > >>I'm so confused... i don't know what is right and wrong. Both my > > > > fiancee > > > > > >>and I are born-again Christians, we will in no way have sex > before > > > > > >>marriage > > > > > >>so if we made/make that pledge to god is living together before > > > > marriage > > > > a > > > > > >>sin? Is it wrong? And what do i do if it is? I know of other > > > > christian > > > > > >>couples who have lived together before marriage. I am just so > > > > scattered > > > > > >>right now. Please pray for clarity for me? And above all, pray > Gods > > > > will > > > > > >>be done. > > > > > >>I love you all. > > > > > >>Jenifer Barr. > > > > > >>When the trumpet blows... I'm outta here! > > > > > >>AIM: jenibear1998 > > > > > >>msn > > > > > >>[log in to unmask] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-- > > >No virus found in this incoming message. > > >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > >Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/54 - Release Date: 7/21/2005 > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.2/54 - Release Date: 7/21/2005