Thanks for this info.

Jarte is a nice app in that it doesn't drag the system down like Word, 
so if you need some formatting features without needing a whole lot, 
it's an option. The developers seem to be aware of accessibility because 
the program tells me it's in screen reader mode, so when I have a little 
more time, I'll send them feedback about tables and so on.

I use Open Office sometimes, and it works fairly well for me.

I'll definitely try Stan's suggestion of Text Pad.

I use Word because, as a translator, I sometimes need to deal with 
advanced formatting. I don't like the ribbons. For screen reader users, 
they're definitely slower as you can't easily skip past the groups of 
settings you're not interested in, but I've been working with them long 
enough that I'm used to them, and I've even memorized some of the long 
and mostly random sequences of keys needed for features I use frequently.

On 10/2/2015 6:11 AM, Stan Berman wrote:
> Thanks.
>
> Iunderstand your comments re copying content and the formatting issues.  I
> do not like Office 2007 and later ribbon menus and  consequently have
> avoided upgrading to 2010 which I own -- I think the format features you
> mention  do not apply to Office versions before 2007, although I don't
> remember whether it was there in 2007 and began in 2010.    I've been
> considering installing WindowEyes to see how well I like its handling of the
> ribbon menus.
>
> My bottom line is that I would gladly trade off features that are nice but
> never or rarely used for improved usability/accessibility of those features
> that are central to the purposes for which products are used.
>
> Stan
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Visually Impaired Computer Users' Group List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain
> Sent: Friday, October 02, 2015 8:11 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [VICUG-L] Word processing and text editing [was "Re: [VICUG-L]
> Jarte [was] Finding Docs Created in Word with Jarte"]
>
> I'm just responding to one small piece of your message. When pasting content
> into a MS Word document, you can use the special paste dialog to determine
> if you copy it in as plain text or preserve the formatting from the original
> source. You can also change the default behavior. I have it set to copy text
> without formatting as the default to avoid the problems you're talking about
> below, namely getting mixed formatting in a document that is hard to sort
> out for a blind user.
>
> I did consider TextPad, but I chose to go with NoteTab Pro myself. It has
> some of the same features that you like about TextPad.
>
> BTW, it looks like you meant to send your reply to the list and not just to
> me, so I'm putting this on the list myself.
>
> On 10/02/2015 06:43 AM, Stan Berman wrote:
>> Sorry, but I am just reading this posting as the first in the thread.
>> However, I just want to point you to a text editor that is quite
>> robust and you might try it for free and then if it does what you
>> want, you can purchase  it to get the tech support or you can continue to
> use it for free.
>> The program is  TextPad which is a text editor that has lots of features.
>>
>>    You can create documents in a variety of formats from plain text to
> HTML.
>> Although I haven't been using it much for a few years  because of the
>> character of my needs and I couldn't get it to install on my Windows 7
>> machine but recently solved that problem, and will resume using it more.
>>
>>
>> I haven't tried creating accessible tables in TextPad, but I would
>> guess that one could easily do it in HTML, just as one could create
>> lists and headings (H1-H6) and bulleted lists.  You can create macros
>> within the program and search, find and replace for character strings
>> concurrently in multiple files (I have done this in several hundred
>> files at one time and it's quick and easy.
>>
>> TextPad, unlike notepad , provides a list of recently used files
>> making it much more usable than Microsoft's NotePad.
>>
>> TextPad can be found at http://www.textpad.com/ -- it is  a UK company
>> and if you don't pay the  approximately $30-35 fee, you will get some
>> periodic requests to purchase a license which is worth it.
>>
>> I like it  a lot as it doesn't have all those MS Word  features that
>> automatically  do things that create problems for a blind user, e.g.
>> automatically carrying  unidentified formatting code with copied
>> content to a new file and then  messing up the  new document's
>> formatting because you get both format coding together -- so you get
>> double indents and bullets within indents, or mixed fonts in the
>> document, and so on, all difficult to discern if you are blind.
>>
>>
>>
>> There are a couple MS Office-like products that might be worth a
>> look-see, like Open Office and both are supposed to be pretty accessible.
>>
>> I would also look at WordPerfect -- I had it and preferred it over MS
>> Office products but couldn't use it with my computer at one point, but
>> I believe that it may be workable  now and the last version I have and
>> used had some nice features, like the ability to switch back and forth
>> between MS Word and WordPerfect modes.  I haven't gotten around to
>> checking on WordPerfect yet but will do so in the next week or so.
>> The last time I bought it the cost was just $100 which could be that low
> because I already own a license.
>> I find MS Outlook to be a royal pain in the neck -- it is creating all
>> sorts of problems and the ribbon menus are terrible in my opinion.
>> Good luck
>>
>> Stan
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Visually Impaired Computer Users' Group List
>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain
>> Sent: Thursday, October 01, 2015 11:48 PM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [VICUG-L] Jarte [was] Finding Docs Created in Word with
>> Jarte
>>
>> So I don't disagree that Jarte isn't a nice program, but if I can't
>> use it with my screen reader to work with lists, tables, headings and
>> the like then what's the advantage of using Jarte over something like a
> text editor?
>> On 10/01/2015 09:39 PM, Ana G wrote:
>>> Jarte is hit and miss with formatting.
>>>
>>> Both Jaws and NVDA announce bullet and numbers correctly.
>>>
>>> In both, you can use the screen reader key and the letter F to hear
>>> that characters are bolded or italicized.
>>>
>>> Neither screen reader seems to detect tables or the rows or columns
>>> in a table.
>>>
>>> when I used the paragraph formatting submenu to automatically indent
>>> the first line of every paragraph, I couldn't tell the that this was
>>> working by using the screen reader.
>>>
>>> I haven't figured out how to create headings. This may be one of the
>>> features that comes with the paid version, or it may be buried somewhere.
>>>
>>> It's actually a nice little word processor. I hope the accessibility
>>> kinks can be worked out.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/27/2015 7:28 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote:
>>>> How does Jarte and a screen reader do with announcing advanced
>>>> formatting attributes like headings, lists and tables?
>>>
>>>       VICUG-L is the Visually Impaired Computer User Group List.
>>> Archived on the World Wide Web at
>>>       http://listserv.icors.org/archives/vicug-l.html
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>> --
>> Christopher (CJ)
>> chaltain at Gmail
>>
>>
>>       VICUG-L is the Visually Impaired Computer User Group List.
>> Archived on the World Wide Web at
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>>
> --
> Christopher (CJ)
> chaltain at Gmail
>
>
>      VICUG-L is the Visually Impaired Computer User Group List.
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