Bravo, Ron.   
 
So eloquently written!
 
Geoff doesn't deserve the time of day, let alone the thoughtfulness you put into this post.
 
Maybe he will just go away back under his stone.
 
Thank you for reminding the list of the ground rules of decency.
 
Best,
Batsheva


________________________________
From: Ron Hoggan <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask] 
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:41 PM
Subject: Re: Ages in Chaos

Hi Geoff, 
The starting point for the debate between Creationism and the theory of evolution was when you started calling creationism "rubbish" and expressing contempt for others who have beliefs that diverge from yours.

The issue, for me, is not a question of being politically correct. It is one of showing a modicum of respect for all members of this list, regardless of whether we share the same beliefs. 

While I believe that the theory of evolution is mostly correct, it is still a set of beliefs based on observations and tests of those observations. Similarly, most people with strong religious beliefs (which may also apply to me - I'm not sure) will assert that their beliefs have repeatedly been supported by their observations and tests of those observations. (That is certainly true for me, but it is a topic for another day.)

You are entitled to believe differently and express those divergent beliefs. What I take exception to is calling the beliefs that others hold dearly "rubbish" and calling other people names simply because you disagree with them, and the contempt you express for others' beliefs. 

I sorely doubt that the "rain from Mars" hypothesis is likely to stand up to any measure of scientific scrutiny. However, if William wants to believe in it I think that he should be allowed to express that belief without worry about name calling and offensive, sweeping generalizations. 

When people debate/argue using your tactics I begin to suspect that they are more than a little insecure in their own beliefs. Another article of my faith is that we are all a lot alike. And I must admit that I have thoughtlessly posted some offensive name-calling in my early days of posting to various forums on the Internet. Part of that was my sense of anonymity. Another part of it was that I was in a lot of pain at the time.  My brother had lymphoma and I couldn't get his doctors to order blood tests for celiac disease even though I was a biopsy-diagnosed celiac. In the end, my brother died without ever being tested for celiac disease. And he died thinking I was a nut who thought that a gluten free diet can cure all of the world's ailments. 

I am deeply saddened by all of this, and I remember being as disparaging of others' perspectives as you have been on this list. I don't know what pain you might be experiencing or what other issues in your life might be causing you to be so careless about the feelings of others but I would appreciate it if you would take those extra moments to review and revise your comments so they express your views without the nasty edge. 

I'm asking you to tone down your language in the interest of encouraging everyone to express their views without fear that they will be the subject of gratuitous insults. Even this debate offers to hone our collective understandings of adaptation if we can set aside the personal attacks. 

best wishes, 
Ron