>It does.  There have never been vegetarian populations of humans
>or hominids.  For at least 2.5 millions years humans and their
>predecessors (at least since Australopithecus) have eaten meat,
>in addition to plant foods, of course.  During this time they
>have used hand-held tools to help kill and eat them, which is
>why they haven't depended on claws, fangs, etc.  Amadeus Schmidt
>is a subscriber to this list who attempts to achieve an
>approximately paleo diet without eating meat, but he does not
>argue that paleolithic humans were in fact vegetarians.  Such an
>argument simply cannot be supported.

But Todd, you have not really addressed the carnivorous properties of the
rounded jaw and squared teeth of our distant ancestors and ourselves. Don't
these teeth represent a basically vegetarian ancestory? (Because we do have
a canine, I say "basically" vegetarian.)

I think that we are omnivores but relied more on vegetation rather than
animals for our daily food (plants can't run away from us). Because we are
so slow at running, it's doubtful whether we could catch many small animals
without using tremendous amounts of energy in the process (unless we used
traps). The same would hold for bringing down larger animals although the
protein payoff would be much greater. Hunting would not always be successful.

Overall, my impression is that we would have been something like 90%
vegetarians and 10% meat-eaters. My feeling is that the neo-Paleo diet
espoused on this list somewhat inverts that ratio to something like 70%/30%,
meat to vegetables. For now, I disagree with that ratio.

For a look at the teeth of the Australopithicines (missing the upper jaw);

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/jaws.html
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/crania.html

Re: Colons

>This is often heard, but not entirely accurate.  There is a lot
>of good information about this sort of thing at
>http://beyondveg.com, but I suggest in particular that you read
>Loren Cordain's summary of the issues in
>http://beyondveg.com/cordain-l/metab-carn/metabolic-carnivory-1a.shtml

I will look at that.

Re: Grains

>The basic view is that grains were not part of the paleolithic
>diet, so our attempts to emulate that diet should also exclude
>them.  Although it is clear (to me, anyway) that some people
>manage to be quite healthy and long-lived despite eating grains,
>it is also true that grains are implicated in the spread of a
>number of autoimmune and degenerative diseases.  Again, rather
>that repeat what others have done better, I'll refer you again to
>Loren Cordain:
>http://beyondveg.com/cordain-l/grains-leg/grains-legumes-1a.shtml

I happen to stumble upon Cordain's articles before reading your post and he
seems to have a lot of interesting things to say plus his work seems very
well referenced. Haven't read all of it yet, though.

On Erasmus's and Weil's credentials: I agree that it doesn't necessarily
mean that what they say HAS to be right BUT it is helpful if their opinions
are formed based on a thorough understanding of the subject. That's just
common sense.

Talk to you later,

Marilyn