On Tue, 19 Sep 2000 12:26:21 +1000, Ben Balzer <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

>All mammalian cells express ABO antigens, I believe.

This makes D'Adamos classification of 0=hunter/gatherer
and A=agriculturalist ridiculous.

If more mamals have them, then all blood groups are *much* older
than only 10k years.

>As for there being good and bad lectins- absolutely! I think of lectins
>much like bacteria- there are good and bad ones..
>
>So how do we separate them out- I've been trying to get a sensible response
>from lectin scientists but they're all a bit test tube oriented. ...
> It seems like we may have adapted to some defensive
>lectins in the edible nuts (maybe some of us haven't)...
> By the way, grain eating birds have
>adapted to the lectins in grains.

By the way lectins can be inactivated by macro sugars. Do these birds
secrete such sugars? Or does some kind of gut bacteria?

I think it's easy to imagine, that no creature is fond of beeing
eaten.
Except fruit, which is thought exactely to be eaten.
Nevertheless some fruit/berries are "poisonous" (maybe they want to
weed out
unspecialized, unsymbiont eaters).

All other plants will certainly have and always have had some type of
chemical "defense" which makes eating or digesting them more
difficult.

But nearly all animals are designed to eat plants (plus a few eating
animals
eating plants). Animal kingdom *has to* rely on plants (animals don't
have
own photosyntheses - and no synthesis of much more).

This is why i think, that *all* plant eaters -humans too- already have
digestive means to cope with protective substances. These are of
course more
or less "toxic". In smaller or bigger amounts.

When primates changed from beeing fruitarian into a savannah dweller,
they
also switsched to foods which are stronger protected than fruit.
Nuts and other seeds, roots.

10000 years ago Cereals became a staple.
Cereals and other one-year-lasting plants can be expected to be
stronger
protected than tree seeds and roots. Because trees turn their surplus
to
seeds (and are protected by the shell of earth). While a one-year
plant
-like grass- has to put all of it's effort into the seed only.

Humans broadened their edible spectrum largely by various processing
and
selection techniques. Selecting or preferring  a proper season and
grade of
ripenes is common amoung all animals.  Humans used as processing
technique
also in hunter and gathering times heat processing, soaking in water,
leeching. The !Kung do process their main nutrition source, the
mongongo nut
with great effort.

Cereals are more difficult to process. Grinding, mixing with water,
resting
(for phytase downgrading) and baking are the traditional techniques.
These made usage of this most nutritious source of vitamins, energy
and
protein as a staple possible. Which gave rise to the vehement
developement
towards settlements, science and communication since neolithic times.

To my astonishment even in todays grain-eating society , the
traditional
processing methods are nearly unknown or at least unused.
It's very hard to get a bread which is *not* made unproperly fast with
yeast
(instead of sourdough).

hmm now it grew more to a little essay as to a normal newsgroup
posting.
However I'd be interested in your thoughts, ideas and arguments on
this.

Ben:
>I call the reactive ones Hannibal lectins after Hannibal Lecter as they are
>so devious, insidious and nasty. They are exquisitely versatile as they can
>trigger almost any receptor in the body and make cells do things they would
>never have dreamed of, or simply die.

I suppose that depends, if such a lectin molecude makes is through the
intestinal walls. Most lectin-testing -at leats that of D'Adamo- is
done with blood. Normally food shouldn't come in contact with blood,
or only digested.
The main miracle seems to be, why some lectins would enter into the
blood.
Or probable what enter into the blood will normally be other proteins
of the
carrying creature, like gluten.

The intestinal walls do not only pass very small molecules, like
sugars,
amino acids and fat. At least some bigger molekules are passed inside.
The vitamins for example. Thiamin and Vitamin b12 are rather big
molecules
and do pass. Some big enzymes are assumed to pass too.
Is there a malfunctioning in the selection system? Obviously yes, if
big molecules like gluten can cause antibodies in the blood.
Can lectins cause the malfunction of the gut-wall-passing system?

cheers

Amadeus S.