Peter:
>>He is after all a vegetarian claiming to emulate a
>>paleo diet.

Moody:
>Yes, but he recognizes that his implementation of paleo
>is incomplete,

As it is for all of us.  Not even Amadeus can argue that.

Moody:
>in comparison with what paleo people actually ate.

Yes, but by not eating animal foods his diet is even
further away from resembling a paleo diet.
Furthermore, the proportions of the various food groups
in his diet are off from a paleo perspective -
and possibly even a so-called paleo vegetarian perspective.
A paleo diet has no more than 5% of calories
of grains and legumes by the most liberal of standards.
Sweet fruits, low fiber veggies and dairy (I believe that
he eats small amounts of cheese) maybe another 15%.
Subtotal of 20% of foods in A's diet that might be in a
paleo category but still not necessarily paleo
quality. That leaves 85% for tubers, high starch veggies,
nuts and seeds. I doubt that A's diet is even close to
this.  If it is, he does deserve some credit for his efforts
but he is still left with the big issue of animal foods
unresolved.

Moody:
>I'm dead certain that my implementation of paleo is also
>incomplete, since I eat relatively little organ meat, no,
>grubs, etc.

Yes, but with the animal foods in your diet you are a lot
closer to approximating a paleo diet.

Peter:
>>One argument he makes is that meat has been a type of
>>survival food for times when supplies of plant foods
>>were low. In my book that is the same as arguing
>>that meat is an expendable, not really a true part
>>of the paleolithic diet.

Moody:
>That's an interesting point.  Amadeus indeed argues that
>there's nothing in meat that you can't get from other
>paleo sources, or make in your own body, with the exception
>of B-12.  Thus, he acknowledges that paleo people ate meat
>to get nutrients X, Y, and Z, but he argues that it's possible
>to get those same nutrients from paleo plant sources without
>eating meat.

He does but

1)the same nutrient from a plant and from an animal
are not necessarily absorbed equally well
2) there might very well be nutrients in animal foods that
have not been discovered yet
3)a paleo diet including animal foods will naturally be
a lower carbohyrate diet than one without.
4)no h&g tribes have ever been found to be vegetarian.

Therefore if Amadeus is serious about eating paleo,
he is left with only one option and that is to try
including animal foods in his diet.

Moody:
>I happen to think that Amadeus's diet providets
>less protein than what is desirable, but I admit
>that the whole "protein requirement" issue is far
>from resolved.

No disagreement here.

Moody:
>Obfuscation?  I generally don't have any trouble
>understanding what Amadeus is arguing.

Are you by this saying that you cannot relate to any
of the frustration that has been expressed about this
in all of the time that he has been on the list?

Peter:
>>It is bit of a cop-out, IMO.  I think he is not engaging
>>because his bluff is being called.

Moody:
>What bluff?

That his aim is true.  That he is sincere about eating
a paleo diet.

Peter