Charles sent:
**The only reason people start agriculture is when  they are
forced to. Humans by nature are nomadic, and prefer to roam far and
wide.Hunting and gathering are much more enjoyable and stimulating than
monoculture. It is only when their territory is restricted by other
groups,or other reasons, that agriculture develops.**

Ardeith writes:
I have some problems with this.....

**"The only reason people start agriculture is when  they are
forced to."**

Can we make a distinction between intensive agriculture
and gardening?   People everywhere have "gardened",
planting and encouraging favored plant foods...just as
the Native tribes in the US did....planting maize, beans,
squashes, groundnuts and lots of varieties of 'greens'...
Granted these were additions to their meaty diets,
rather than the sole source of food....but our ancestors
were too smart to pass up any food source......and
there is no reason to think my European ancestors
were less smart than the Native American tribes.....

**"Humans by nature are nomadic, and prefer to roam far and
wide."**

Many of them did....sure....particularly those who
followed the herds on their migrations.....but many
early humans spent their whole lives within a specific
area...just moving around to take advantage of
different resources at different seasons.....I imagine
coastal peoples knew when the turtles came ashore
to lay eggs, and made sure they were near the shore
at that time to harvest eggs and turtles....later in the
year they might have moved into an area where the
berries were ripening....or other fruits that could be
dried and taken on walk-about.....

**"Hunting and gathering are much more enjoyable and
stimulating than monoculture."**

Granted...at least for those able to get out there and
hunt.....for others, gathering berries, fruits, seeds,
nuts, roots, tubers, leaves, and such "small" meat
sources as bugs, grubs, eggs, snails, turtles, birds,
rabbits, squirrels, snakes and such would also fill
hungry bellies.......

**"It is only when their territory is restricted by other
groups,or other reasons, that agriculture develops."**

Monoculture/intensive agriculture is no doubt a fairly
recent development.....perhaps 10-12 K years old...
.....and I'll also grant that my own knowledge is more
or less restricted to the US native tribes.....who did
not practice monoculture....but rather planted and
encouraged a wide variety of favored foods......
but so did our European ancestors.....long before
Rome marched across Europe, the native tribes
there were planting and harvesting favored plant
foods as well as hunting game animals and herding
goats, pigs, sheep, cattle, and horses (which they
also ate).........and they were doing it with sharp
sticks and chipped stone tools....until they learned
to make spear points and arrowheads of metals.

I think sometimes we tend to forget that humans
have adapted to live in a wide variety of climates.
People in hot, humid climates use and develop a
different set of resources than people in hot, dry
climates use.....the same can be said for cold
climates.   In the Artic, blubber is a staple...along
with dried fish, caribou, and other animals....very
little plant food is available except in the summer
and whatever can be preserved for the winter.

In cold climates such as Northern Europe or
Northern America, fats are more important than
they would be for those living in warmer climates.
Perhaps this relates to being able to hunt year
round in warmer climates so you don't have to
preserve food for the winter........

And I think we tend to forget the studies that have
shown that H-G's could gather enough foods...
plant and animal....to live comfortably even if the
hunting party came up empty......I know my
English and Irish ancestors did not have access
to the amount of beef that I eat every week...
they used poultry, pork, mutton and fish more
often than beef.....and if you go far enough back,
they probably ate more insects and such than
I'm ever going to...........one thing they did not
have was access to finely milled white flours and
massive amounts of sugar......which only become
practical and available in mass quantities when
you practice monocultural/intensive agriculture.

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