Gambia-l,

This is an interview published by WEST AFRICA MAGAZINE. Enjoy it.



"My Vision and Mission"


Exclusive interview with President Yahya Jammeh

conducted in Kanilai, The Gambia, by Adama Gaye and Tidiane Sy of West
Africa Magazine
(reproduced uneditted with permission)


On October 18, Gambian voters will elect their President in an election that
promises to be open and certainly hot. Several candidates will be in the
race, including the incumbent President, the military turned civilian leader
of the country. At 36 years old, Yahya Jammeh, who took over power in a
military coup in August 1994 but became President after a contested
presidential race few years later, knows already who will be challenging
him. One of his contenders is Ousainou Darboe, who will be leading a
coalition of three opposition parties, while the remaining candidates
represent less important political groups. One person who many said was
tempted to join the battle was former President Dawda Jawara, 77 years old
and therefore unable to be part of a race that is restricted to candidates
under 65 years as required by the Constitution.


West Africa (WA): Mr President, your country is heading towards the October
18th presidential elections and already the opposition leaders have started
their campaign with a motto: they are saying, " Jammeh must go". What is
your response to them?


Yahya Jammeh (YJ): Well, that's what they want but that's something they
will never get. Because, remember that these are the same people that were
in power for thirty years and they messed up the country; So the" Jammeh
must go" campaign is just a rhetoric campaign. But it is the people of The
Gambia who would decide and they know where their interest lies, and who
better cares for them.


WA: Do you think your party is still strong enough to fight this opposition
?

YJ: This is the bottom line: we are not fighting this opposition which has
no agenda for the people. And the people of The Gambia have been awakened.
They are no longer bent on political intrigue or empty promises. Seven years
of my administration have taught the Gambians several valuable lessons.


WA: What, for instance?


President Jammeh:' My Achievements are numerous...'

YJ: That politics can no longer be based on tribe, that politicking should
be about discussing development issues; and they know also that elections
are about choosing those who can better represent the people and deliver the
goods. The people of The Gambia are today more development oriented, they
are aware of their rights.They understand better politics and political
party affiliations, or how to choose their leaders, contrary to what used to
be the case in the past when politics was more about tribes and empty
promises.


WA: What do you make of the decision of the main opposition parties to come
up with a coalition to challenge you at the next election?

YJ: Well, the coalition has always been there, even if it was not official.
Those who set it up are the same people we overthrew. They were supporting
the opposition, were voting for the opposition in 1996, so they are
formalising something that was already there. We know all of them and their
supporters will never support us for whatever reason. Coalition or not, they
are the same people. It is like having old wine in new bottles. That does
not mean anything to us.


WA: What would you consider as your major achievement or achievements that
would justify you being re-elected?

YJ: Hummm! [Hesitates and smiles] My achievements are numerous... I would
have preferred to leave it to the people to talk about my achievements. Lets
me just mention for instance what we have achieved in education. We have now
a university. In 1992, there was a debate about it. They said Gambia was not
fit for a university! How can there be any development in this new
millennium without getting rid of ignorance in Africa? Our basic problem in
Africa stems from ignorance and all political violence in Africa is a
consequence of ignorance. Look at these countries, including my country, the
electorate is illiterate 80 or 90 per cent, and political leaders, for their
own political perpetuation, don't want the people to know the difference
between development and trivial issues like tribalism and ego-centricism. As
a result, whenever elections are organised in those countries you see that
political debates are centred on tribal issues while development and social
issues take a back seat. All that is debated is about which tribe leaders
come from, which is the majority tribe and which tribe first settled in the
whatever country. These are trivial issues. If it were not a consequence of
this ignorance, Africans would have left tribalism centuries ago and worked
together as Africans. Nobody would be kicking us around, as is the case now:
I am proud of the university! During the 400 hundred years of British rule
and 32 years of the former government, the Gambians used to see universities
in Dakar and outside of The Gambia. Today, we have a university of our own,
including a medical school.


WA: Is health also a priority?

YJ: Of course, because no matter how conscious your people are and how well
educated they are, if they are not healthy there cannot be development.


WA: What has been done in this regard?

YJ: From maybe two doctors during the 400 years of British rule, two to
three doctors in the whole country, and maybe five doctors in the public
system from 1965 to 1994, we have now more than 250 qualified doctors.
Besides, in every major village or town we have a health team. The infant
mortality has gone down, and a lot of cases that used to be critical are
being addressed now. We have health centres around the country and now in
every major health centre in this country, surgical operations can be
carried out.


WA: You have referred to tribalism as being a dominant issue in the previous
regime. Would you say that, under your rule, the vast majority of the
Gambian people rather think now in terms of development instead of
tribalism?

YJ: In their majority, the Gambian people are patriotic citizens who are
more concerned about the welfare and well-being of their country and its
citizens. They are not concerned about what language you speak. Besides,
when you analyse the existing tribes in the country, basically there is no
difference between the Wolof, the Mandinka or the Jola [the three main
groups]. The only difference is the language. So the majority of the people
of The Gambia don't believe in tribalism any more.




WA: Is that 100 per cent the case?

YJ: Of course, you will find some people who nurture tribalistic views. It's
like racism. There is nothing as stupid as being a racist, but there are
still people who believe in racism. Those who still believe in tribalism can
be mainly found in the opposition. Take for instance what happened recently
when one of them from the People's Progressive Party, a former minister of
Foreign Affair, said during a rally that his constituents, although made up
in majority with Mandingo and Jola tribes. They have been in power for
thirty years, but seven years after they were overturned, they still have
nothing to tell the people. What the people are after is not whether their
Member of Parliament is Jola or Mandingo, but who can take care of their
problems and solve them.


WA: Would you say that Ousainou Darboe is from that school of thought ?

YJ: He is the leader of the party that is talking about tribalism. So what
do you think?


WA: What about former President Jawara who is allegedly interested in coming
back to internal politics here?

YJ: Well, he is a daydreamer. I will be very happy to have him because he
has a lot of questions to answer. So that will be the best thing to happen
to this country, Jawara coming and facing the Commission to give to the
Gambian people a balance sheet of his rule for thirty-two years.


WA: Your opposition also criticises you on the human rights front. What is
your response?

YJ: What is the opposition's definition of human rights? Anybody can just
have his own definition.


WA: What is your own definition of human rights?

YJ: My own definition of human rights is that you are treated as a human
being as long as you treat anybody else as a human being. That is human
rights.


WA: What do you think of countries like the United States that consider
human rights as a key element of their foreign policy as far as Africa is
concerned? And to what extent do you think that in countries like The Gambia
they may be wrong in their approach?

Y J: Once again, all depends on what definition one gives to human rights.
Amadou Diallo, a Guinean, was shot with 39 bullets in his body by policemen
in New York a few years back, but his killers were released. So let us not
confuse genuine human rights with using the term "human rights" as a
smokescreen to propagate a political agenda.


WA: What else on that issue?

YJ: The human rights question is like that of religion. One may have his own
political agenda [and] hide behind his religion to pursue a political
objective. That is wrong. You cannot use Islam or any other religion for
your political ambition. This is the way the West has been pursuing human
rights in Africa... There is no single Western or Eastern country that has
no human rights problem. What they want us to do is to let criminals go
because they are hiding behind a political party. We say no to this. Nobody
is above the law in this country; Whoever hides behind whatever screen to
commit any offence will be dealt with according to the law whether or not
other countries see it as a violation of human rights. We do not dictate to
other people how they should behave, nobody should tell us what laws are
good or bad for us. After all, these so-called democracy lecturers are the
same people who came to Africa to colonise us. They still have colonies,
some of them still fighting for independence. Instead of fixing their own
problems at home, they want to divert attention. When they came to impose
their colonialism, they found us with governments, better system of
governance, Africa was more advanced than the West.


WA: How come?

YJ: If that was not the case, they would not have come to steal our gold and
diamond and capture Africans to work for them. They called Africa the dark
continent but when they came to the continent they only brought wine and
could only give as gifts, mirrors, glass, pieces of bottles, while the
Africans gave them gold and diamonds. Do you think a Westerner would stay in
Africa for nothing for four hundred years with our mosquitoes and malaria?
How, despite their long presence in Africa, the continent still backward
while their countries are developed?



President Jammeh commissioning a power plant in Banjul.

We should not be fooled by the Western propaganda done by hypocrites talking
endlessly about democracy, the rule of law and whatever: Consider how they
dealt with movements that asked independence for their colonies. How they
set up units to kill people. These are extra-judiciary executions of people
who have not been sentenced to death. How can they come to Africa and tell
us about democracy and human rights? Most of them are the worst dictators.
Why can't they compensate Africa for the slave trade?

Billions of dollars have been given to the Jews for six million of them
killed during the Second World War, while many millions of Africans perished
during the slave trade. And how many millions of Africans perished during
colonialism? You come from Francophone Africa and you know the French used
to have travaux forcés. They forced Africans to work and build roads. They
forced them to carry the so-called government commissioners through the
jungle and those commissioners had a whip to beat Africans to work. If the
same people now telling us about democracy were concerned about Africa, they
would have written off its debt. We know how the debt was created. All the
money was sent back to the West. Let them commit economic aid. In fact, let
them repay us.


WA: Don't you think that the propaganda of the Western world that you have
mentioned is taking root, considering that, that even military rulers like
yourself have turned civilian in order to abide by the Western description
of democracy?

YJ: You are wrong as far as I am concerned...


W A: Why then did you turn civilian?

YJ: Because the Gambian people asked me to leave the army and lead them! I
had no intention of standing for politics because I knew from that time on
if I were to hand over to any civilian president, he would not have been
comfortable with me in the army, or even in the country. So my plan was
after handing over to whoever the people of The Gambia would have elected, I
would have gone back to my village and continue farming -I am a farmer. But
you are right to say that the Western propaganda is taking root in many
countries, because most of us African leaders do not believe in God, do not
have faith. They take the West as God who can make you or undo you. That is
why they dance to the tune of the West. But for people like us who believe
in God, we fight for justice. I having nothing against the West, but what I
want is for Africa to be treated with respect, because the Western world is
developed through African blood, sweat and tears -through African resources.
You cannot be drinking from an old well from which you build your houses,
your family and then come back and spit into the well. It is unacceptable.


WA: Mr President, you speak like a crusader for Africa; you were born on May
25, on "Africa Day", do you see any connection with that?

YJ: My year of birth came before the day was declared African Liberation
Day. The bottom line is that we Africans have been accepting a lot of
insults. Now, look at how the Westerners who are talking about democracy and
human rights are treating African immigrants in their countries or at their
airports. The way they search you and treat you would be different for a
white man or even for a hippie. What do they do to their own skinheads? They
say they can do nothing against them because they enjoy freedom of
association and expression. They have set up these groups and allowed them
in the name of freedom of expression to come out openly and tell that
"Africans must go". Can't you see the difference between what they preach
and what they practise?


WA: What do you think the African response to these attitudes should be,
particularly from the leaders of the continent?



President Yahya Jammeh on July 22nd Revolution Anniversary

YJ: Not only the leadership, the mass of Africans must wake up! We have been
sleeping for a very long time. We should wake up to look around us and see
that these Westerners are doing nothing to help us but to try to destroy
Africa, the main interest of all Western countries is to see that Africa
remains a market for their products, a source of raw material for them. Why
are they talking about privatisation? The moment you nod your head they have
already identified the Western companies to buy you privatised companies,
and the companies they are privatising are highly profit-making ones:
electricity, telecommunications...

Now if they control your telecommunications, they control your electricity
and water, they are effectively taking your country, because they will tell
your people when to drink water, when to sleep and when to dream and when to
communicate, and whatever you say they will know! And we Africans are told
about "globalisation" and we start dancing "alleluia". We should respect
ourselves, believe in God and defend our dignity otherwise we'll continue to
be dictated to.


WA: Africans are d the fools in all this.

YJ: Consider the BBC focus on Africa programme which is a platform for
African rebels or political dissidents to insult their presidents. You have
network Uk which have never interview the IRA. The Voice of America does not
broadcast within the United States of America, it's meant to broadcast
outside America and every rebel in every part of the world and especially in
Africa, has access to the Western mass media. Can't we Africans open our
eyes and see what the West is after? Their agenda is very blatant.


WA: Do you believe in press freedom and freedom of expression?

YJ: If I did not believe in press freedom, I would not be talking to you!


WA: What do you think of the African journalists?

YJ: You African journalists are doing a great disservice to Africa


WA: Why?

YJ: Because when you look at African newspapers, in most cases, they run
articles that embarrass their people, articles that are damaging, not only
to the leadership. You cook up stories that are terrible. By the way I am
not talking of "you" in particular; but of the African journalist in
general. Please let us defend Africa. The Western journalists, inasmuch as
they want to be radical in defending their freedom of expression, never
forget to defend their country; of course if we do wrong things you should
report them, but don't accuse me of doing something wrong when I have done
nothing wrong. When I say I don't like this brand, you say the President
criticised the camera or even the cameraman. Sometimes, the journalist wants
to think for us, and put in our mouth things that we never said or meant.


WA: From what you said earlier, the feeling is that Africans have a share of
responsibility in what is happening in their continent.

YJ: When the Western people came to Africa it was supposedly in order to
civilise us, but by the time they left we were poorer. But they say they
left a lot of money which was mismanaged by us. But before they came to
Africa, they did not have skyscrapers. All they had were bungalows and they
were living in basements. Today they have multi-storey buildings, 400
hundred years after their sojourn in Africa [began]. Can't you see the
connection? How many countries in the West have diamonds or other mineral
resources? Yet they are selling diamonds. If they were genuinely interested
in the welfare of the Africans, why then do they fix the prices of our
products against their will? By the way, could you tell me who is the
President of the world markets? Everybody knows who is the President of the
World Bank, no one can tell who is the powerful President of the world
market who can decide the price of African coffee, cocoa and timber and
other raw materials. And Africans have to accept that world market price,
when it does not even have a President or known headquarters.


WA: Let us come back to the Gambia's internal politics: are you confident of
winning the forthcoming election, and, if that is so, why?

YJ: I am more than confident that I will win. The majority of the Gambians,
who are development oriented, owe me that victory. It in fact for them, if
they want the country to move forward. They know who can do that for them.


WA: What will be your agenda if you are re-elected?

YJ: My agenda has always been the same: to make the Gambians proud by
developing the country where Western labourers will come in search of jobs
in Africa.


WA: You are involved in the search for a solution to the crisis in the
southern Senegalese region of Cassamance where there has been a rebellion
over the last 20 years. What has prompted you in being involved in this
issue?

YJ: I don't believe in countries. I believe in Africa. Borders separating
African countries are nothing but lines drawn by Western colonialists to
divide us. Those Europeans went to war twice over Africa. They called it
World War I and II. They wanted more colonies. No African king was present
went the West decided at the Berlin conference to partition Africa. The
bottom line is that these borders are artificial. The reason why we are poor
and backward today is becau



PEACE

Tombong

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