Hi Mr Jow,

Good to hear you again.  Those of branded by the 'esoteric' Bamba Laye
Jallow as the 'Halifa loo def rek bahna' group should always make sure we
continue with our resolve.  I urge you and Mark to keep up the good work
you've been doing.  History will out the truth.  We know the sincere critics
and torch bearers of the truth.

IT was rather amusing to read Mr JAllow's opaque attempt to chide Halifa on
his ego.  I need some help to decipher the new meaning of ego.

Peace,

Mboge


>From: Pasamba Jow <[log in to unmask]>
>Reply-To: The Gambia and related-issues mailing list
><[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Taking Stock
>Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 03:58:34 GMT
>
>Hi Buhary,
>You deserve commendation for a well written piece.I was not infact  going
>to
>engage in this debate ,but it is always difficult to sit back and listen to
>people make unconstructive and unsincere attacks on P.D.O.I.S.
>I am a P.D.O.I.S supporter who truely believes in their policies.I am of
>the
>fact that P.D.O.I.S is the only viable party to free the Gambia from both
>economic and political ruins  we find ourselves today.P.D.O.I.S has always
>being consistent with its stance against any form of domination of the
>Gambian people.To accuse them of being soft or to be bought by THE FACIST
>is
>outright nonsense.
>When OUSAINOU DARBO was supporting YAYA'S revolution ,taking pictures with
>him ,Sidia and Halifa were challenging decree no.4, when the .P.P.P
>MINISTERS were clowning and showing allegiance to JAMMEH,P.D.O.I.S was
>battling with the A. F .P.R.C for the respect of fundamental rights and
>freedom.When SHERIFF DIBBA decided to go on a political leave HALIFA and
>SIDIA were getting ready to be arrested ,an arrest which SHERIFF DIBBA
>praised calling P.D.O.I.S trouble makers.
>I am always not supprise by such unfair,unfounded and outrageous
>accussations of P.D.O.I.S.I would take this opportunity to show you how
>people have habbit of spreading rumors .After the student massacre on April
>10 ,i called halifa to suggest that he should visit the U.S.A in order to
>address some of the burning issues of the day.I called the organizers of
>the
>A.L.D to suggest the coming of HALIFA ,an idea of which they welcomed.I
>told
>them that they donot have to spend a dime ,that three P.D.O.I.S supporters
>myself included will finance his trip,only to hear people saying that
>HALIFA'S trip
>was financed by jammeh.Let us keep speaking the truth and working for a
>free
>and democratic GAMBIA.We need a Gambia of the people and not of
>leaders,aGambia that will guarantee her citizens liberty ,dignity and
>prosperity.
>PEACE
>PASAMBA JOW COACH
>>From: momodou olly-mboge <[log in to unmask]>
>>Reply-To: The Gambia and related-issues mailing list
>><[log in to unmask]>
>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>Subject: Re: Taking Stock
>>Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 11:49:37 GMT
>>
>>Hi Buharry,
>>
>>I concur to the sentiments you raised in this reply to Hamjatta.  We
>>reserve
>>the right to express our appreciation to whoever we feel is right in the
>>political arena in Gambia.  I pride myself in commending people who i
>>think
>>are sincere and constructive. My endeavour in this world is to learn from
>>others to help me be a better person.    Those of us, to use Hamjatta's
>>words who are 'openly and nakedly PDOIS biased' seem to be more tolerant
>>in
>>our debate with others. However, i appreciate the fact that all
>>politicians
>>are to be kept on their toes.
>>
>>Lately, this forum has degenerated to name calling.  I am yet to see any
>>politician in the Gambia who is willing to engage people as Halifa is
>>doing.
>>We might not belong to the esoteric circle of the Bamba Layes  and co. but
>>we know from our small bearings how to make an informed choice.
>>
>>To all PDOIS cynics, thank you for keeping the 'Great Leader' and his
>>disciples(of which i am one) on our toes.
>>
>>Buharry, thank you once again for a brilliant piece.
>>
>>Greetings,
>>
>>Mboge
>>
>>P.S.  I will keep you posted for the up coming debate between (Hamjatta
>>and
>>HAlifa)
>>
>>>From: MOMODOU BUHARRY GASSAMA <[log in to unmask]>
>>>Reply-To: The Gambia and related-issues mailing list
>>><[log in to unmask]>
>>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>>Subject: Re: Taking Stock
>>>Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 04:17:54 +0200
>>>
>>>Hi Hamjatta!
>>>                   When you wrote "over to you gentlemen", I assumed as
>>>one
>>>of those who has recently praised Halifa and co. that your invitation
>>>included me. Before going to the issues you raised, I don't think there
>>>is
>>>anything wrong with expressing one's appreciation of the personalities
>>>behind PDOIS and the personal sacrifices they have made for our country.
>>>That is a prerogative we are within our rights to enjoy. I for one am
>>>truly
>>>impressed by Halifa and co. and I take pride in making it known. In fact,
>>>you impress me and I have made it known on a number of occasions on this
>>>list and the first time I made it known was during your first debate with
>>>none other than Halifa. I had and still have the prerogative to declare
>>>that Halifa, you and anyone else impress me. Declaring such is in my
>>>opinion a better alternative to what we have seen lately on the L.
>>>
>>>             That aside, you wrote: "Indeed, writer after writer merely
>>>stresses the point the Geat Leader, Halifa himself, makes in his missives
>>>to the Jammeh since the April murders. They claim there is no credible
>>>alternative to the Great Leader sitting in his Churchill's Town HQs
>>>penning
>>>letters which implore the dictator to have a rethink on his strangle hold
>>>on the Gambian people and advocating that elections [even if as their
>>>deliverance are being muddled by throw-away threats by the gov't which
>>>cast
>>>question marks over them ever taking place] and the political process are
>>>t! he only viable options existing to the Gambian people to deal with
>>>Jammeh."
>>>
>>>      Maybe other writers claimed that there is no other option to Halifa
>>>penning letters. I can therefore not comment on that because I don't
>>>agree
>>>with the statement. As to whether the political process is the only
>>>viable
>>>option, I feel that the political process coupled with continuous
>>>internal
>>>and external pressure is a much better alternative than the repeated
>>>calls
>>>for violent means of bringing about change. Whereas change that is
>>>brought
>>>about politically can offer tested leaders who have had a chance to
>>>explain
>>>their policies and programs to the people, change that is brought about
>>>by
>>>violent and sudden means offers a Russian roulette alternative. It is
>>>granted that there is a possibility that such a change of government can
>>>be
>>>effectively and efficiently executed without loss of life and destruction
>>>of property and that such a change can produce a leader who has the
>>>interests of the nation at heart. However, the dangers associated with
>>>that
>>>method are plenty and cannot be ignored. Something can always go wrong
>>>even
>>>with the most carefully planned operation and the result can be
>>>devastating
>>>for our country. Another risk, given that the people executing such
>>>operations can be any Tom, Dick or Harry, is that we might have someone
>>>who
>>>is worse than Yaya. Much, much, much worse. What do we do then? Pray that
>>>someone else violently removes him? Isn't that akin to creating a coup
>>>industry whereby anyone with guts and the blessings of a marabout can
>>>attempt to overthrow a government? What are the implications of such an
>>>industry on the stability and security of our country? Another risk is
>>>that
>>>people propagating for a violent change of government might be doing so
>>>out
>>>of a wish to revenge personal wrongs meted out by the government or by
>>>Yaya. Instead of "praying" Yaya to "Tan" (just joking) and getting on
>>>with
>>>it, they might use the Gambian people as pawns in an endeavour that could
>>>go wrong with horrendous consequences. What would happen if such people
>>>succeed? Would they kill and imprison everyone associated with Yaya? Is
>>>that good for the continuity of our country as a viable entity? Even
>>>though
>>>the political option is not the panacea to The Gambia's ills or even a
>>>likely solution, the risks associated with the violent option are many.
>>>(On
>>>a less related note, acquire IP tracing software and trace some of the IP
>>>addresses of some of the people propagating violent change in The Gambia
>>>and claiming to be in The Gambia, "on the ground", "in the this" or "in
>>>the
>>>that" and you'll be really surprised when you see some writing from
>>>Russia,
>>>England, US etc.)
>>>
>>>             You also wrote: "If as these Alumni of PDOIS/Foroyaa are
>>>gloating about the success or inevitability of success of the strategy of
>>>their party, surely it's about time one takes them to task and ask them
>>>to
>>>empirically state how the aforesaid strategy has made any concrete
>>>difference since the gruesome murders of April 10 and 11. It is time we
>>>ask
>>>ourselves what is working or practically workable as we struggle with the
>>>dictator."
>>>
>>>      It is empirically impossible to measure whether PDOIS' strategy
>>>vis-à-vis the April massacre has had some effect just as it is
>>>empirically
>>>impossible to determine if it didn't have an effect. Why? Because even if
>>>one were to institute a study, the available variables would render
>>>coming
>>>to a conclusion practically impossible due to, among other reasons, the
>>>multi-pronged reaction and handling of the massacre. That aside, one can
>>>see that the total and universal condemnation, including but not limited
>>>to
>>>PDOIS' approach, has had an effect no matter how small. Yaya could have
>>>reacted when he came back from Cuba in his usual fashion and picked up
>>>the
>>>line of his officials, which so infuriated the Gambian people. He didn't.
>>>A
>>>commission was instituted. That also is an indication of the effect the
>>>pressures had. The Government's fear in releasing the Coroner's Report
>>>also
>>>indicates a fear of the reaction of the people assuming that the report
>>>is
>>>damning. I am not saying that all this is the panacea to the issue of the
>>>April massacre. It might even be counter-productive to the desire to get
>>>to
>>>the truth but at least giving in to the pressures levied by among others,
>>>PDOIS, is an indication of the effect that penning letters at Churchill's
>>>Town or strongly condemning brutal acts from Oxford can have. The letters
>>>of PDOIS and the actions of others made it possible for the ban on the
>>>UDP
>>>to hold rallies to be lifted. That also is testimony, no matter how
>>>small,
>>>that the PDOIS strategy is having an effect.
>>>
>>>             On the issue of the political parties staging civil
>>>disobedience measures, maybe all the political parties can give you an
>>>answer. I personally respect the decisions of the parties to either
>>>engage
>>>in such or not, given that they are more in tune with the realities on
>>>the
>>>ground than I am. I respect the fact that such a move is a strategic one
>>>that has to consider timing,practicability, risk not only to one's self
>>>but
>>>also to supporters, resources and a host of other variables and has to be
>>>done after the parties feel that they do not have any other option.
>>>Whilst
>>>I can see the benefits of such a move, I can also see risks involved
>>>which
>>>include giving Yaya the opportunity to declare a state of emergency,
>>>rounding up all the political leaders and indefinitely postponing the
>>>elections. It has happened in other countries.
>>>
>>>      Hamjatta, I have tried to deal with the issues you raised. I
>>>however
>>>have some questions for you if you don't mind, given that you wrote: "It
>>>is
>>>time we ask ourselves what is working or practically workable as we
>>>struggle with the dictator." The questions are:
>>>
>>>   1.. What has been your strategy since the April massacre as a
>>>concerned
>>>citizen to ensure that justice is served?
>>>   2.. How is it different from PDOIS'?
>>>   3.. How have you implemented the strategy or how do you intend to
>>>implement the strategy?
>>>   4.. Can you guarantee or at least gauge whether the results of your
>>>strategy will have a higher success rate than PDOIS'?
>>>   5.. What do you base such predictions or pronouncements on?
>>>   6.. What alternative approach can you proffer to deal with the current
>>>political impasse in The Gambia given that PDOIS' approach is not, in
>>>your
>>>opinion, working?
>>>   7.. How do you intend to institute your alternative?
>>>   8.. What do you expect PDOIS and the other political parties to do in
>>>the meantime?
>>>   9.. Given that you feel that the political process is not a workable
>>>alternative, do you believe that the only available or workable option
>>>would be a violent overthrow of the Government?
>>>   10.. When? What if that is not possible in the next one, two, five,
>>>ten
>>>years?
>>>   11.. Should the political parties stop all operations and wait for the
>>>alternative you propose or do you believe that they are obliged under the
>>>Constitution of The Gambia and their own to propagate by lawful means
>>>their
>>>beliefs?
>>>      Sorry for the long list of questions. Anyway, The Gambia is in a
>>>quagmire and I don't think that PDOIS or their supporters claim to have
>>>the
>>>universal remedy for the country's woes. What they claim is to have small
>>>steps which are pursued through pressure be it in the form of letters or
>>>otherwise. PDOIS and their supporters are however not the only people to
>>>have a claim to The Gambia. If the other stakeholders, in the form of
>>>political parties and concerned citizens, contribute in their small ways
>>>a
>>>cure will eventually be found when all adds up. Thank you and have a good
>>>evening.
>>>
>>>
>>>                                                         Buharry.
>>>
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