Brad, I believe that what our Lord said is talking about our
fellowship with him.  I don't equate forgiveness with salvation.  I
believe we can be saved and undealt with sin.  I don't believe that
this state continues for years.  Yes, it is one of those apparent
contradictions that takes study to understand.

earlier, Brad D, wrote:
>How do we explain Jesus explanation  of if we do not forgive other's sins
>against us, he will not forgive  ours? And does forgiveness equate
>salvation? Or can we be saved and yet have unforgiven sins to be dealt
>with? Curious to the apparent contradiction in scripture then.
>
>Brad
>
>on 06:06 PM 7/28/2005, John Schwery said:
>I believe that forgiveness is unconditional in that it does not break
>our relationship with God.  Unconfessed sin can break our fellowship
>with Him, however.  I believe that if anyone adds anything to
>salvation, then, grace is no longer grace, but works have been added,
>perverting the gospel.  This doesn't mean that I believe that we can
>sin and get away with it, but sin does not break our relationship
>with Him.  If it does, then, all of us are toast.  Notice that in
>Psalm 51, David did not say to the Lord, restore unto me Thy
>salvation, but restore unto me, the Joy of Thy salvation.  When our
>fellowship is broken with the Lord, we no longer have that peace that
>passes all understanding or the joy of the Lord.
>
>earlier, Vinny Samarco, wrote:
>  >Hi Brad,
>  >I am glad you brought this point up.  I have heard of too many
>ministries
>  >who make God out to be this spineless lovy-dovey blob that will let
>everyone
>  >do anything, and require absolutely nothing from them.  This is truly a
>  >perversion of the gospel.  I think most
>  >Christians would be totally shocked if they would ever do a complete
>study
>  >on all the if's and buts in the bible.  They would see that after Jesus
>  >reveals himself to us, forgives our sins, etc. there are some
>requirements
>  >that The Lord requires of all his people.  I'm not talking about
>  >self-imposed works, I am talking about biblical requirements.
>  >Vinny
>  >----- Original Message -----
>  >From: "Brad D" <[log in to unmask]>
>  >To: <[log in to unmask]>
>  >Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 5:50 AM
>  >Subject: Conditional forgiveness??
>  >
>  >
>  > > "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will
>also
>  > > forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither
>will
>  > > your Father forgive your trespasses."-- Matthew 6:14-15
>  > >
>  > > This Jesus taught his disciples, believers, not those who opposed his
>  > > message; purpose;  and existence. These words just after instructing
>them
>  > > how to pray, and continued after these verses to instruct them on
>conduct
>  > > and attitudes. Despite what we've come to know as "The Lord's Prayer"
>  > > stating "and forgive us our trespass as we forgive those who trespass
>  > > against us", Jesus felt that precept needing to be blatantly noted
>after
>  > > the prayer. We indeed find freedom in forgiving others, but as
>with  the
>  > > message of the Word, "it is not about us", it in this case is about
>giving
>  > > grace to others, just as we've received grace unto ourselves. God
>knows
>  > > that we have enough trouble with that concept, that he holds our
>  > > forgiveness randsome. This indeed sounds conditional to me.
>  > >
>  > > Brad
>  > >
>
>John

John