I am not a vegan, and even eating fruit is killing - I recognize that killing to eat is different than killing for the sake of killing.
In fact Amber and I think being vegan over the killing issue is silly - becasue a dead plant is still dead. The killing we were discussing was that of the human kind - and we don't eat each other - as a rule. Tho I understand we taste like chiken - have no 1st hand knowledge here. Hmmmmm possible over popuation solution? GRIN
As I said - my idea are highly impractical
> you know that you and i split when we go into the
> gods, so i am going just agree to disagree with you.
> but, gods or G-d notwithstanding, if killing any of
> the creaturs is wrong what are you going to do with
> plants. u eat them. they are killed.
> --- Trisha Cummings <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > Hi Ken,
> >
> > Well, I believe when we have the wisdom to
> > create life from nothing =
> > then we can take it - until we then we should have
> > respect for the Gods =
> > beings - no doubt they fulfill their purpose as it
> > is willed - so to =
> > kill the Gods creatures is to diss the Gods. Each of
> > us is a ripple in =
> > the pond of life - and the ultimate end of ripple is
> > not apparent to us =
> > but does have form and function in the over all
> > design. To kill is to =
> > kill. I am not facing Gods one day - looking into
> > Their sorrow filled =
> > faces and trying to answer why I thought killing one
> > of their creatures =
> > was an OK thing. Only to hear them say but I ended
> > the birth of their =
> > child how would have cured cancer, AIDS, insanity -
> > whatever. When I am =
> > wise like the Gods then can make an informed
> > decision on killing being =
> > an okay thing. Remember my beliefs are based on
> > non-Christian based =
> > ideas - there is no Devil, to make me do - I and I
> > alone chose my =
> > actions and am accountable for them and responsible
> > for their ripples, =
> > therefore I do a lot of what if's before choosing a
> > path. I tend to walk =
> > away from anything I think would be harmful. Of
> > course, I am human so I =
> > do make mistakes, have bad days, and attack my from
> > points of insecurity =
> > - as we all do.=20
> >
> > I think we can agree - we see this
> > differently. Life experiences, =
> > belief systems, and upbringing have us all bringing
> > slightly different =
> > ideas to the table - the trick is sample and think
> > about what's brought =
> > to share, I understand exactly what you saying, and
> > I know that for real =
> > life my ideas are not partical - at this point in
> > time.=20
> >
> > I think we should drop all the criminals on
> > an island and let them deal =
> > with each other - that's a death sentence in
> > reality.
> >
> >
> > Trisha
> >
> >
> > > well, trish if someone is going to kill me, and i
> > kill
> > > him instead, i don't really think that if his
> > family
> > > came after me that i'd be any worse off than had i
> > let
> > > him kill me, i'd just be dead a little later. you
> > are
> > > anti death penalty too. i think the government is
> > > ordained to carry out executions amung other
> > things.
> > >=20
> > > --- Trisha Cummings <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > > HI Ken,
> > > >
> > > > Hope you had good weekend.
> > > >
> > > > Yes, I am saying killing is killing - and no
> > > > matter what justification =3D
> > > > you use, it is wrong. I certainly understand
> > killing
> > > > in self-denfense or =3D
> > > > in protection of ones child - I still will not
> > say
> > > > it is right, and if =3D
> > > > it is then so is euthansia and abortion, etc.
> > And
> > > > this where we differ - =3D
> > > > you are saying some killing is okay - and I am
> > > > saying its never - okay. =3D
> > > > I don't obey the 10 commandments - I follow the
> > "An
> > > > It Harm None" - Law. =3D
> > > > This takes killing out of the good/bad category.>
> > It
> > > > places it the must =3D
> > > > think about the whole - cause and effect thing.
> > If I
> > > > kill someone - even =3D
> > > > justifiable, I can cause a great deal of harm -
> > > > perhaps - that now dead =3D
> > > > persons family - is an eye for eye type - and
> > they
> > > > come back and kill me =3D
> > > > - or one of mine - and here we go on the "war"
> > type
> > > > wagon - so where =3D
> > > > does the justifable killing end. In most of the
> > hot
> > > > spots in the world =3D
> > > > these people have been eradicating each other
> > for
> > > > centuries, and will =3D
> > > > continue to. That's what justifing killing does.
> > > > Killing is counter =3D
> > > > productive to the species survival needs. You
> > will
> > > > notice - most animals =3D
> > > > do not wage war on each other. There are no
> > tiger
> > > > armies taking on other =3D
> > > > tiger armies. We can stand to learn a bit from
> > the
> > > > "beasties". The 2 top =3D
> > > > predators on the planet - are us and the sharks
> > and
> > > > they are loosing to =3D
> > > > us. It is time to learn to tame the
> > > > predator/fight/flight instincts =3D
> > > > before we eradicate all life here - we no longer
> > > > surcome to massive =3D
> > > > disease epidemitics - so its time to put the
> > grey
> > > > matter to work. This =3D
> > > > planet is the Garden of Eden - and we can put it
> > > > back there.
> > > >
> > > > Trisha
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > you were not saying anything about sacrificing
> > > > your
> > > > > self, you were saying "killing is killing"
> > after
> > > > kat
> > > > > basically ask if you'd kill to protect "amy"
> > > > (amber).
> > > > > in addittion to being willing to kill if i had
> > a
> > > > > weapon, i too would sacrifice myself. but that
> > > > wasn't
> > > > > what i percieved you to be saying.
> > > > > i might not have any more chance of winning
> > the
> > > > > fight than you. i guess both our bodies are
> > pretty
> > > > > well worn out. i once was stronger, but, the
> > years
> > > > > have taken their toll.
> > > > > --- Trisha Cummings <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > > > > Ken,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You have better chance against a man than
> > I
> > > > do -
> > > > > > my object would be =3D3D
> > > > > > to give them time to get away. I am all of
> > 4'10"
> > > > > > tall and 50 years old, =3D3D
> > > > > > not to mention - kinda disabled around the
> > > > corners.
> > > > > > And to tell you =3D3D
> > > > > > turth - all this is hypothetical - what
> > would
> > > > really
> > > > > > happened - would =3D3D
> > > > > > only be known - if this happened. And I
> > could
> > > > > > actually skip that - =3D3D
> > > > > > thanks........ What we discussing is
> > everyone
> > > > > > assuming they will know =3D3D
> > > > > > how they will act. Sometimes we just don't
> > act
> > > > that
> > > > > > way in an emergency.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Trisha
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > From: ken barber
> > [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> > > > > > > Sent: Friday, October 03, 2003 2:31 PM
> > > > > > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: was brother now
> > Polictics
> > > > > > >=3D3D20
> > > > > > > call it spitting hair or whatever you
> > like,
> > > > you'd
> > > > > > like
> > > > > > > it to be just that simple, but, it is not.
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
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