the question is just a ploy. if you begin to loose a
discussion on the ideas in security, you say "you are
questioning my patriotism." then the other person is
supposed to get off subject to convence you that he is
not questioning your patriotism instead of staying on
the facts he is giving you. it is a ploy just like
when you are losing on social and other political
matters and you can't come up with facts to refute the
other person, then you call him a bigot, a racist, a
homophobe or you say he is engaging in hate speech. he
is then supposed to back off because no one wants to
be seen as any of these things and so you silenece him
by this ploy when you can't win on facts. both of
these are recognised as ploys now and not nearly so
many are backing off any more. instead for the most
part now ore are just ignoring thee ploys.
--- Trisha Cummings <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> HI Mike,
>
> Its good red herring - you then have to defend why
> you are a good American, which gets away from the
> topic you are actually trying to get attention on.
> It like the prosecutor asking "So when was the last
> time you beat your wife?" You are instantly already
> in the wrong. rarely can one have a discussion where
> differences are the topic and someone not employ one
> or the 13 fallacies of logic - which draw the
> attention from the topic to the individual. It is
> actually being a good American to question the
> Status Quo, but its not being a good team player nor
> does questioning authority ever go over well with
> authority especially insecure authority. While we
> have great a constitution and it tries hard to
> protect from ourselves, it is can only work as long
> as everyone is a thinking being, and not just a
> blind follower. Jefferson mandated education because
> he felt educated people made better decisions, where
> more successful at business. The problem being that
> thinking goes the way of the Dodo once emotionally
> charged persuasive rhetoric and events co-inside to
> create a "common evil" even if the evil is more our
> imagination than reality. We need to fear ourselves
> much more than any terrorist. They killed roughly
> 3,000 and so far we have more than in war fatalities
> and over 20,000 injuries. We have done a much better
> number on ourselves than they could have ever hoped
> to. Plus we have lost any standing in the world as a
> leader - and any ground gained as a 1st world nation
> - real problems are on the back burner or under the
> rug - and we are rapidly spiraling into becoming a
> 3rd world country. Yet here we are carefully divided
> in groups so we have no power, Christians vs. Every
> other Religion, Democratic vs. Republicans, Rich vs.
> poor, able-bodied vs. disabled, white vs. everything
> other ethnicity - United we Stand - Divided we fall.
> We have fallen and only a miracle can reverse the
> damage now. The enemy is never without - the enemy
> is within. We have always been loosely united by
> causes - usually external - but now we have no great
> external cause to create unity. The War on make
> believe Terrorism isn't it. I believe those folks
> hate us - with cause and would love to do us damages
> - if they could. But how? By preying on our
> weaknesses. Its not hard now - everyone here hates
> everyone else and feels used and cheated they don't
> have everything they want - after all the
> Constitution doesn't promise us a good life but does
> establish the following.
>
> "We the People of the United States, in Order to
> form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure
> domestic Tranquility, provide for the common
> defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the
> Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity,
> do ordain and establish this Constitution for the
> United States of America."
>
> And the Declaration of Independence states - "We
> hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men
> are created equal, that they are endowed by their
> Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among
> these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of
> Happiness."
>
> Neither document insures that everyone will have
> everything they want - only the chance to go for it.
> Over the years we have radically changed from a
> frontier nation to a "civilized" nation. People
> today have nice lives and some folks live in
> horrendous excess. We have a highly visible - highly
> technical press that beats each other to the bad
> stuff, and stuffs it down our throats 24/7. This
> wasn't so in the past. If the press where as
> motivated to seeking out good and things that better
> our society we would be happier but they focus on
> the Oh My God stuff - because at some level we all
> give into that base instinct to stare at the
> accident, gloat over someone else's misfortune, etc.
> As individuals we all have an impact on not only
> our lives but the lives around us and society. We
> chose the groups we line up with and our attitudes.
> To many people lined up with the wrong idea and its
> now a run away train. I wish I had an answer to the
> problems, I truly do. But it would take people
> taking a truly hard look at themselves and accepting
> responsibility and accountability at every level -
> right to how we ourselves run our lives - I
> certainly can't handle money, and I thought if I
> just made enough it would work - no learning to
> handle what I have would work. That sad fact about
> my budget - no doubt what is and works not only at
> my house and some of your houses but is also at the
> county level, the city level the state level and the
> country level. Its not the government - its the
> individuals and the flaws and the forging together
> of these on ever higher group levels that we need to
> solve.
>
> We are like alcoholics always having the bottle to
> blame and never seeing its our choice to drink. Some
> of this is instinctive - The I didn't do it -
> reflex. WE need to get over this. This is the
> ruination of us - not the myriad of things we lay
> the blame on. What is the problem - not who is at
> fault - what is the problem, and how can we fix it.
> We so busy whining, complaining and finger pointing
> we never get around to solving the problem and we
> attack those who do - back to "being a questioned as
> a Good American". Its the endless putting out little
> fires and never seeking the source - so you will put
> out fires till doomsday until you address the
> source.
>
> Trisha
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cerebral Palsy List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf
> Of Mike Collis
> Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2006 6:39 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: I have a question
>
>
> Why is it that one's patriotism is called into
> question when one questions
> or disagrees with the status quo now?
>
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