On 09/18/98 05:43:05 you wrote:
>From:    Rick Strong <[log in to unmask]>
>
>James,  your posts are intriguing and cause me to wonder about the
>linkage between caloric restriction and the chaotic aspects of H/G (G/H
>by Amadeus) nutrition. That is, I think we can reasonably hyothesize
>that paleo human foraging efforts often left them a few calories shy of
>a load.  Might caloric restriction stats reflect a dietary reality
>characterized by seasonal >feast and famine.

A little background:
The goals of a CRON (calorie restriction with optimal nutrition) are to
extend life through the not completely explained mechanisms of age
retardation which it causes.

Indeed, the mechanism by which this slowing of aging operates is
intimately linked with the body's starvation responses.  When the body
does not get a certain level of calories (ad lib, or "as much as you
want") certain processes are stopped or slowed down to allow the more
critical ones to function.  This starts occuring at very modest levels of
restriction (~5%-10%).  The more an organism is restricted the more
processes that get shut down.  A couple of these include reproduction in
females, futile cycle expenditure of calories (heat generation from
excess calories).  The vital functions are always kept to the last, like
organ and blood health.

The result is that the body goes into a kind of holding pattern, one by
product of which is slower aging.  Keep in mind that the most visible
life extension occurs at the most severe levels of restriction.  These
extreme levels are considered impractical for people to do voluntarily.
We are talking about restriction in excess of 25%, up to perhaps 50%-60%
where you would start dying of starvation.

>has your reading supllied you with a confident take that paleo is
>consistent in some fashion with CR.  I know that your answer is yes but
>I may have missed why...Rick

In some fashion, perhaps.  My conclusions are mostly in comparison to a
modern diet, and are even automatically confirmed if you consider a SAD
diet.  It basically follows that h/g foods have a higher nutrient/calorie
ratio than modern processed foods.  This is the underlying principle in a
CRON diet, or also called a high/low diet for high nutrition/low
calories.  Even here you will get quite a bit of arguement, saying that
our ancestors went around eating mostly high fat bone marrow or high
caloric organ meats or whatever.  For many reasons, I believe the best
diet for me, trying to follow a h/g pattern, includes mostly plant
materials, and a reasonable but smaller of animal products than many
propose on this list.

I see two aspects to correlating h/g diets with a high/low diet.  First,
by eating all natural, whole foods you automatically restrict calories.
You will be very happy with smaller calorie levels, given that your total
food volume will be greater, even at the lower caloric levels.

Second:  I don't necessarily know that h/g's voluntarily restricted
calories, I believe they would not, given the choice.  Remember
though, that the above arguement says they are already eating
moderately restricted levels and being satisfied.  (Although there is
plenty of fasting as a method to purge the spirit, body and mind in the
literature.)  The question is, did the conditions which caused the
evolution of the starvation responses occur often enough to be a common
condition?  That is hard to say.  The times were surely hard now and
then, I have no idea of how often.  In extreme cases the effects would
mean h/g starvation altogether.

My approach is to simply use the benefits of CR, given the body's
responses to reduced calories, to the benefit of my health and longevity.
Also keep in mind, that the words "calorie restriction" cause
misunderstanding and a negative response in some people (usually the
close minded ones who already have all the answers they need, meaning
they already know it all).  Fabulous health benefits follow from eating a
high/low diet, even with no restriction, which is what many people on
this list are doing from what I have seen.  Also, true life-extending
benefits may be seen with as little as 5%-10% restriction.  Take it from
me, these levels are very easy to do.  When you get to 15%-20% is when it
gets real hard, although the life extension is more pronounced.

I also don't think h/g's did this on purpose, or even successfully if
they were trying.  E.g., if the typical h/g diet is a CR type diet, why
don't we see h/g's living into their 120's more often?

I do see a strong link in CR and h/g diets, mostly in the high/low area,
which does mean mild restriction by default.

James Crocker
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"Violence is the last refuge of the
 incompetent." - Salvor Hardin
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