Edward Campbell asked:

> What has happened to make you think about
> implementing a McDougall program?

No, no -- MCDOUGALL-HEALTH is a proposed support group for those who find a
high starch, very low fat do-able.

I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole, it would kill me.

But I have two friends that have followed it and learned how to be very
successful using McDougall's recommendations to deal with their challenges
-- it is not easy, nor is low carb, there are pitfalls -- but, for them it
works, they are happy and their Doctors are happy.

For me Low Carb Works and works well -- the key is LOW CARB, I cannot
consume carbohydrates period -- my attempt at including more fruit and more
vegetables that are edible raw as described in NeanderThin does not work
for me.

But Like Ray's post points out, I must reduce the fruits and vegetables --
they are carbohydrates, I CANNOT eat them with impunity as so many
followers of NeaderThin can -- that is what #$$%& me off -- why me?  I can
be totally successful on an Atkins 5-20 carbs per day max as long as those
carbs come from other than fruits and vegetables like carrots.

I can eat cheese, I can eat cream -- all with impunity -- when I do, my BGs
are perfect, my blood lipids are perfect and I got lots of energy.

I do very well indeed on Meat, Fish, Poultry and Nuts but novice
NeanderThin me wanted the fruits too -- BUT I can't have them in the
quantity novice me thought I could.

Even on the veggies I have to go pre-insulin day diabetic diet, boil them
thrice and rinse to rid them of carbohydrates.

When I stepped on the scale 10 days ago, to find myself 15 pounds over my
ideal weight which I had fought tooth and nail to achieve, I was one %$#&
off person, extremely angry and extremely frustrated -- why me, ME the
STONE and SPEAR who has frequently said enough is enough of high carbing.

Insidiously those carbs had snuck back into my diet in the form of fruits
and vegetables.

We all know that "One Shoe Does Not Fit ALL" regarding a persons diet.  In
respect of that, I am trying to help some friends put together a support
group for a "shoe" that they feel fits them and in so doing, I had an
opportunity to exchange emails with Johnny McDougall who is convinced and
as armed with dietary facts as to the rightness of his approach as is
Ornish, Atkins, Spears, the Eades, Ray et al. -- what is in common was the
"strength" of conviction.

Then also, that "theory" given that there is ample protein, then as starch
increases, dietary fat must decrease AND as starch decreases, it appears
dietary fat can increase -- I found this connection fascinating in the
attempt to explain two opposits swings of the dietary pendulum.

One friend is an Atkins drop out, total failure, cholesterol dramatically
increased, she hit a plateau, her diabetes was suffereing, she was
depressed yet her husband is more NeanderThin, so that is there household,
a mixed bag of what works -- BTW, there will be a big baked pig dinner at
her place in August, over three hundred attended last year and all
PALEOFOOD folk are invited -- simple, when you are having fun and people
are people it is real hard to notice if one is eating the flank of a deep
pit baked pig or a tofu veggie burger with no mayo.

Anyhow, I got a grip on things now -- I've gone thru Ray's post, got my act
together and rearranged the things on my din-din plate -- what isn't there
are "sugar" carbohydrates -- I'm a happy Paleo-Camper now.

Grant

STONE and SPEAR         [log in to unmask]
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