Catherine, can I assume that you are using Acrobat Reader DC to read PDF
documents with tables? If so, I've found the results mixed, though much more
reliable than Kurzweil and Open Book. The issue though is that the
assumption by service agencies and government entities that all PDF
documents are accessible is misguided and that it satisfies accessibility
requirements. I wouldn't want the courts to accept this as fact.
Working with a local college which was receiving complaints from visually
impaired students regarding the posting of inaccessible PDF documents, I
suggested that the staff post html documents instead, and that seemed to
satisfy everyone. As has been mentioned, the great strength of PDF is
document security. True, html can be hacked, but not easily. I suspect,
however, that the ultimate answer is adopting Epub as a standard.
-----Original Message-----
From: Visually Impaired Computer Users' Group List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Catherine Getchell
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2018 9:08 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [VICUG-L] Accessibility of PDF Documents
Hi Tony,
I think one thing worth clarifying in this discussion is whether you're
talking about text-encoded PDF's, such as those converted from Word, or
image-based PDF's, such as those created when you scan a document to your
computer. If you're talking about the former, why bother with a text
converter at all? Tables in PDF format usually read very nicely using the
JAWS table navigation commands. I agree that if you converted them to text,
they'd be a hot mess.
Now if you're talking about image-based PDF's, these aren't truly
accessible, no matter how good your OCR engine is. I love the Convenient
OCR feature in JAWS and use it daily, and you're right that for documents
that are mostly text, this usually works fine. But we all know how much fun
OCR has with converting tables or dealing with other interesting formatting
issues.
While we're on the subject, has anyone had success using Adobe Pro to
actually create a PDF document? As many great tools as it has for helping
document creators ensure accessibility of their documents, as far as I can
tell, the document editing function of Adobe Pro is completely
JAWS-inaccessible. When I contacted Adobe to ask about this, shocker, they
didn't respond. And I haven't found any other online resources. Sure would
be nice to create PDF's myself.
Catherine
-----Original Message-----
From: Visually Impaired Computer Users' Group List
<[log in to unmask]> On Behalf Of Tony Swartz
Sent: Tuesday, May 8, 2018 5:44 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [VICUG-L] Accessibility of PDF Documents
Hello Listers,
I hope the following is appropriate for this list, if not, please direct me
to a list where this discussion would be more appropriate.
My opinion is that documents in the PDF format are not truly accessible,
which is in opposition to the contention of most government entities,
service agencies, and in fact many blind people in the know. If we're
speaking of documents with little formatting complexity, text consisting of
paragraphs and headings, then I would agree that just about any pdf to text
converter will perform the conversion with a great deal of accuracy.
However, if the document contains a degree of complexity, tables, charts,
side bars and the like, I have yet to find a pdf to text converter to
accomplish the conversion reliably. If you disagree with my assessment,
please comment and let me know of your experience, and which converter
you've found to perform the conversion with a high degree of reliability.
As I've said previously, I believe we should be discouraging the use of PDF
and instead promote the use of HTML. I bring this up because I've run into
so many instances when a particularly entity has stated to me that as long
as they can provide the document in a PDF format, they have fulfilled their
obligation to accessibility. Again, I invite any opposing view point, but
please explain how you have arrived at your opinion.
Thank you,
Tony Swartz
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