It seems as though an swr meter between the antenna and the output of the 
internal tuner will give me the ACTUAL swr of the naked antenna.  This is 
the value that the internal tuner is trying to tune.  Of course, it won't 
tell the swr that the transmitter's output tubes/transistors/ICs is seeing.

The Other Howard, WA9RYF
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob, K8LR" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2012 6:46 AM
Subject: Re: Tuning aids, noise bridges, etc.


> Tom,
>
> since you have an internal tuner in your TS480, it will either tune the
> antenna or you'll get a SWR cw error message.  Just remember that an
> internal tuner is not very efficient, it usually sucks out between 10%
> and15% of the output power.  As Buddy mentioned, its not a good idea to 
> hook
> up a watt or SWR meter after an internal tuner as your readings will be 
> way
> off.
>
> Bob, K8LR, [log in to unmask]
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Buddy Brannan" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2012 7:04 AM
> Subject: Re: Tuning aids, noise bridges, etc.
>
>
>    Tom,
>
> You do realize that the TW1 won't actually tell you anything about what =
> your internal tuner is doing, right?
>
> I mean, the meter goes before the tuner, which is impossible if the =
> tuner is internal. So, yeah, you'll get your power out racing, but you =
> won't get an active WR reading, at least not as far as your rig is =
> concerned. It's going to see whatever the internal tuner matches to, but =
> the TW1 won't, since it's necessarily in line after the tuner, not =
> before.=20
> --
> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>
>
>
> On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:59 AM, Tom Behler <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hi, all.
>>=20
>> I have debated about posting this right now, especially in light of =
> all of=20
>> the traffic regarding Trippy's ccurrent saga, since the question I'm =
> going=20
>> to ask may involve posting some repetitive info that already is =
> included in=20
>> the discussion threads.  However, I'm hoping that any responses will =
> pull=20
>> together some knowledge that will help both me and others.  If =
> responding to=20
>> this quiry does involve too much repetition, please feel free to reply =
> off=20
>> list.
>>=20
>> As many of you know, I'm struggling with my HF antenna situation out =
> at the=20
>> RV.  In fact,  the ham radio withdrawals are getting worse with each =
> passing=20
>> week, and I may have to take Howard's Zannex advice soon (grin).
>>=20
>> I'm actually now very close to trying to put up my extra 102-foot G5RV =
> out=20
>> at the camp site, at least temporarily, just to see how it does.  I'll =
> have=20
>> to get clearance from camp ground management, but I hope the fact that =
> we=20
>> have a seasonal pass will help.
>>=20
>> When I do any antenna work out at the RV, I always take the 1 and only =
> TW1=20
>> that I have, so as to be sure to tune for lowest SWR.  It involves =
> tearing=20
>> my home station apart a bit, but is well worth the sacrifice, since I =
> don't=20
>> want to become victim to what Trippy apparently just experienced.  I =
> realize=20
>> that the auto-tuner in my  TS480SAT  should keep me out of trouble, =
> but I=20
>> just want to be doubly sure.
>>=20
>> Anyway, I am in the market for some sort of a tuning aid to use out at =
> the=20
>> RV.  I'd love to get my hands on a used TW1, and will keep a lookout =
> for 1.
>>=20
>> In the event I can't find one, mention of noise bridges has been made =
> here=20
>> on a number of ocasions.  Which noise bridge have you guys found to =
> work the=20
>> best, and can you give me price and other info?
>>=20
>> I could also call Handihams to see if they have any of their old =
> tuning aids=20
>> left, but I believe those are no longer available on a consistent =
> basis.
>>=20
>> Thanks as always and 73 from Tom Behler: KB8TYJ