actually i'd agree that what you say is what should
happen. i just don't think that that is what actually
does happen.
oh, by the way under the constitution it is congress
that controls the budget. the president's is only a
proposal. now that the congress is under democrat
control we'll see if anything changes. i have watched
when the dems were in control pre-1994 and when the
GOP was in control to 2006. the spending pretty much
went about the same.
--- Peter Hunsberger <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:
> On 9/20/07, ken barber <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > oh, i can give a senario (simplified of course
> just to
> > be a little brief although this will still be
> long) .
> > 1. a few scientist notice something they have not
> > noticed before and tells a few more.
>
> When scientists find something they haven't noticed
> before they start
> researching it. They don't tell anyone about it
> until the grants are
> secured.
>
> > 2. a few weeks
> > later they discuss it again and say, yes, i see it
> too
> > now.
>
> Doesn't happen. Papers are peer reviewed; anything
> new or unusual is
> given particular scrutiny.
>
> > 3 they plublish a limited finding. questioning
> > what might cousde this abnormalty but, coming to
> no
> > conclusion.
>
> Any research paper has three main parts: a thesis, a
> body of evidence
> that explores the thesis, a conclusion.
>
> > 4 a leak to the media happens or a media
> > person just finds it. alarm sells! newspapers,
> > magazines. alarm gets viewers on tv and radio. so
> > media gives an alarm. "we are going into an ice
> age x,
> > y, z, scietist says." no mention to start that
> there
> > are just questions out there that are not yet
> > answered.
>
> All published research papers are by definition
> available to the
> media. As I said, I favor Nature and Science.
> They're hefty
> publications; 100 to 300 pages of dense PHD or post
> doc level research
> papers published every two weeks. Few reporters in
> the popular press
> manage to come close to even keeping up with the
> flow, much less
> understanding it.
>
> > 5 some scientist disagree, but, quite reason
> > does not sell. it does not sell newspapers,
> magazines
> > nor does it drive ratings so those scientist are
> > ignored by media.
>
> Doesn't matter to the scientists on either side of
> any given question;
> what matters is that 1) their papers are accepted by
> the research
> journals; 2) the grants keep coming (published
> papers feed grants,
> grants feed published papers, that's the life cycle
> of the scientist,
> the popular media isn't part of it for the most
> part).
>
> > 6. another scientist puts forth a
> > theory in answer to the one ignored and the media
> runs
> > that becouse it sells. " "midwest to become frozen
> > tundra according to scientis b.
>
> That's why I keep telling you to go back to the
> basic research and
> ignore what's in the popular media. Media prints
> what sells
> advertising; big oil and gas fund popular media as
> much as anyone.
>
> > 7. some of the public
> > begins to be alarmed. 8 politicians notice that
> some
> > of the public are allarmed.
> > 9. they look at scientist
> > x,y, z, and b's view and also note that SCIENTIST
> A,
> > C, AND D ARE CALMLY REFUTING IT. WHAT TO DO? WELL
> > ALLARM MAKES THE PUBLIC ACCEPT even demand that
> there
> > be a government program and also the tax to get
> the
> > money to spend.
>
> Unfortunately doesn't happen. Under the Bush
> government NOAA actually
> had it's budget slashed year over year though more
> recent budgets have
> brought back funding; NOAas position was popular
> with the public, but
> unpopular with the politicians in charge. Guess who
> wins in this
> situation? You think the public will hold the
> government accountable
> for slashing NOAAs budget? Most people don't even
> know it happened...
>
> > quiet reason however usually does not
> > a tax levied or nor a program started. so the
> > politicians go with scientist x,y,z, and b since
> they
> > wish to have the money to spend.
>
> Huh ?
>
> > 10 once a proposal is
> > made then the politicians can not allow the alARM
> TO
> > DIE DOWN So they and the media keep quoting the
> > alarmist and iqnoring the descenters.
> > 11. it becomes
> > poplitically incorrect to oppose "conventional
> wisdom,
> > consensus is declared. descent is pretty much
> > censored.
>
> Guess that explains why we're still sending troops
> to the middle east......
>
> > 12 time passes and the costastropee does not
> > happen but, after many years no one seems to
> remember
> > that the decenters "told them so."
>
> Ah, yes, back to the "it happened once so it's going
> to happen again"
> line of reasoning....
>
> > yes it is simplified, but no it is not absurd to
> say
> > that the castastrophe predictions are media
> driven.
> > quite literally most have been.
>
> Sure, that's why I keep telling you, go back and
> read the scientific reports.
>
> > i have read about several in history and lived
> through
> > one myself. when one reads history it is one thing
> but
> > then add in living through an event and when you
> see
> > something that looks similar the light goes on in
> your
> > head "i have seen this before." do you ignore what
> is
> > being presented? no, of course not, but you do
> look at
> > it with a heavy dose of sceptisism.
>
> Sure, but don't let the skepticism mislead you into
> thinking that the
> reports are wrong. Sometimes there actually are
> icebergs in the path
> of the ship and no amount of hubris is going to save
> you.
>
> > you young people can accept everything you are
> given
> > pretty quickly, but, forgive us old goats that
> have to
> > factor in our experience and give things a much
> harder
> > look.
>
> Don't be so quick to make assumptions. Some of us
> old goats actually
> do our own research instead of listening to books
> popularized by the
> far right press.
>
> --
> Peter Hunsberger
>
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