Yero,
Thank you.
May Allah keep you and the entire Ummah on the Siratul Mustaheem, and May He continue to give the wonderful gift of Imaan to His creation.
I also wonder if anyone among the early followers of Sheikh Bamba has ever challenged the innovations of the Bai Faal movement or if any Muslim scholars in modern day Senegal have done so. The sad fact is that unfortunately, nowadays, they are a political force to be exploited by politicians for their own gain, just like the Christian right in this country is used by the Republicans.
Mankind is something else alright.
It is indeed a well known fact that the insane are excused by Allah and so unfortunate that Serigne Bamba's attempt to relay this information to his Talibeh has led to such innovation on the part of those who did not understand. However, I think that again, this is largely due to ignorance propagated by the unwillingness of our societies to debate issues and get to the bottom of it until problems grow into monsters. Perhaps Sheikh Ibra Faal went out and misinformed the people because he misunderstood what Serigne Bamba was trying to tell him and the people believed him without question because he was afterall a talibeh of the serigne.
Jabou
-----Original Message-----
From: Y Jallow <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 12:32 am
Subject: Re: tribute to Salieu Mbackeh /Sis. Jabou
Sister Jabou,
Thank you once more for your debating spirit. For sure as time permits, I will
always surf on those pages to reference certain topics on the archives.
I agree with you totally. It is what I call the unsubstantiated myths. I choose
not to live a mythical life. I think everyone is free to discuss their beliefs.
It shouldn’t be limited to certain areas. It is what I call the “heat
conductors” plugged to the electric switch. Once the switch is turned on then
you obviously hear a shout at the other end. If such topics no matter how
sensitive, are not put to discussion, then when will the truth be dispensed?
This very well supports your argument where the masses are denied to know the
whole truth of circumstances. It gives birth to utter ignorance in black and
white.
Count me number one on those that appreciate these discussions on Islam while
they are healthy. It gives me hope and courage that the way of the Sunnah is one
route to take, and the only attachment I should have. I do a lot of research
just for my personal awareness. I belong to the Ahmed Deedat (May Allah be
pleased with him) school of thought. I don’t subscribe to innovations, for
verify the prophet warned of it as a hated act (Biddah) and then termed it as
disbelief.
Sister Jabou, I tell you what, you are a very educative contributor. Please keep
your pen sharp here to continue to educate the younger growing generations about
their religion. Those grips must be welded firm unshakable. I wish you and your
family well.
Lastly, I honestly pay my respect and humble tribute to Sering Salieu. May Allah
be please with him. It is not certain to me as to whether any of their
succeeding caliphates denounced that part of sectionalism arising through Ebra
Faal (The obedient talibeh) May Allah be pleased on him. Uncle Suntou’s
narration resonates a lot, for according to what I heard the obedient Ebra Faal
used to make even the animals and babies keep fast. I am sure if he was
suffering from any mental disorder, a fault not his’, he still is a great
talibeh of the giant tree, Bamba Ba (May God be pleased with him). It saddened
me further from that angle, a cult like the one observed can rise from it, just
for confusing a statement that emanated from the main tree. If only this story
narrated about Ebra Faal is true and known to the successors of the mat of
Touba, it is as well a great virtue to dispense the truth to those embedded in
the innovation. Where it is the consensus that this high profile matter cannot
be under public forum discussion, then I question the basis for such a barrier
with mildness. If any is hurt by the flowing commentaries under this topic, I
dearly apologize, for my intention is far from it.
I thank God for my soul and for that of my family. I thank Him for making me a
Muslim. Al ham dou lil lah.
Regards,
Yero.
> Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 16:30:06 -0500> From: [log in to unmask]> Subject: Re:
tribute to Salieu Mbackeh /Yero> To: [log in to unmask]> > Yero,> > The
topic of Islam has been discussed vigorously on this forum for a very long time.
Visit the archives when you have time. My personal view is and always has been
that any topic that is relevant and beneficial to us as Gambians or at least a
segment of the population can be discussed here. It is a forum for the
dissemination of ideas as well as a forum where hopefully we can enhance each
other's knowledge about the various issues that are relevant to our society. > I
think one of the problems we Africans have is that we tend to side step issues,
and this not only leads to the proliferation of ignorance, but it promotes the
culture of not talking about a particular subject because you may offend someone
and we all know what that has brought us. E.g, If you discuss politics and
challenge people, they say it is because you hate them.> I have also been told
numerous times by many people that there are folks on the ground who have
appreciated and learned from topics on Islam that were discussed on this forum.
> Rgds,> Jabou> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: Y Jallow
<[log in to unmask]>> To: [log in to unmask]> Sent: Sun, 30 Dec 2007
11:24 am> Subject: Re: tribute to Salieu Mbackeh Ba, Touba-Senegal> > > > > > >
> > > > > > Sister Jabou,> > > Thanks a lot for your clarification. Moments
after I posted, I saw yours also.> > > Some of you who have been here for long
would have to excuse my likes, because I > don’t know how much these discussions
were dealt with here. That’s why I make a > boring contributor sometimes. My
short break is getting over now but I like the > Gambia-L, and will always jump
in as time permits me on topics that interest me. > > > > But al ham dou lil
lah, to the list of Wallace and Malcolm, please add to this > forum, the
honorable Keith Ellison, Congressman of Minnesota. We as Muslims > should be
proud of him. I know I am and hence my bashing lines “2006’s man of > the year”
then. > > > http://www.poetry.com/Publications/display.asp?ID=P8241866&BN=999&PN=5>
> > Kind Regards,> Yero. > > > > > > Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2007 11:10:01 -0500>
From: [log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: > tribute to Salieu Mbackeh Ba,
Touba-Senegal> To: [log in to unmask]> > > I want to clarify that it is
the "bai faals" who are engaged in this shirk.> > Yero's examples of Elijah
Muhammad's son and Malcolm X's renounciation of the > Nation of Islam are prime
examples of the importance of speaking out against > shirk as Muslims and
thereby guiding each other. Infact, this is the duty of > every Muslim,
especially when it comes to matters of shirk because shirk is a > serious matter
since man engaging in shirk and "bida" is how he has managed to > alter the
message of Allah sent to His creation and many times it is done to > benefit
those who engage in it. > Jabou> > > > > > > > -----Original > Message----->
From: [log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask]> Sent: Sun, > 30 Dec 2007
9:16 am> Subject: Re: tribute to Salieu Mbackeh Ba, Touba-Senegal> > > > > > > >
> > > > Suntou,> > My dad's family comes from a village near Touba and > infact,
there are some > family connections for us there. However, my father > left
there as a young man > and never set foot again in touba, nor did I ever > hear
him even mention the > 'maggal' in our household. He was a very pious man > and
avoided shirk at all > cost. The Mourids are engaged in big time shirk and > you
are right, if one were > to speak against it in Senegal , you would be met >
with untold ignorance and > they would probably kill you. This is why those who
> did not want to be > associated with this cult movement left the place.> >
Jabou > Joh> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: SUNTOU TOURAY >
<[log in to unmask]>> To: [log in to unmask]> Sent: Sun, 30 Dec 2007
> 3:01 am> Subject: Re: tribute to Salieu Mbackeh Ba, Touba-Senegal> > > > > > >
> > > > > yero,some info on amadou bamba .> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:AhmaduBamba.jpg>
> > what i know of the mbye faal movement.i need some one to verify my info .the
> > information was posted on bantaba a while ago.have a read.> yero this was
posted > in july 2007.> > this posting may irritate some people but that is the
> > historical account i heard about the mbay faals or the touba murids.> why
are > the grand sons and family of serign bamba maintaining a religious order >
or > doctrine that have nothing to do with islam ? who was serign bamba bah ?>
what > brand of islam did he adhered to ? who was his teacher and who are his >
> students ? would he tollerate this situation happpening in Touba in senegal >
> today if alive? who is sheik ibra faal?> the short story goes as follows .the
> creation of mbye faal in touba .sheik ibra > faal was believe to be a student
of > serign bamba .they narrated that ibra faal > was having a mental disorder
.he > was acting strange and advicing his own family > to do strange things
.ibra faal > was very loyal to sereign bamba ,he would do any > > thing for
bamba but serign > bamba knew his loyal sarvant has a mental > problem.they said
ibra faal would > advice his family and some villagers to make > even children
fast during ramadam > .he would advice people to make there > livestocks not eat
any thing during > fasting. this unislamic statements reach > serign bamba .he
summond sheik ibra > faal and asked him about all the strange > things he was
doing .he ibra faal > admitted to making those comments.> from that point serign
bamba bah ,they said > narrated the hadith of prophet > muhammad (pbuh) '' three
types of human beings > are excuse from religious duties > ,one a mad person.
some one insane ,one who > cannot distinguise between good and > evil .secondly
a child before he/she reach > adulthood .children are not > accountable for
religious things they do .if they > do good things fine if not > fine ,but the
parents should bring up chids with > descipline and care. thirdly > some one
sleeping .if one is sleeping he/she is > not accountable for any thing at > >
that period''.> > now serign bamba assess > sheik ibra faal's mental state and
came to the > conclusion that the man is > insane ,or unstable. he then use that
hadith of > prophet muhammad to advice > sheik ibra faal not to engage in any
acts of worship > like fasting ,praying and > so on.> this statement of serign
bamba became distorted by many in senegal. they > > concluded that serign bamba
said to ibra faal ''don't pray i will surfice you > > infront of God in
judgement day ''. how unaccurate. who is serign bamba to > have > that status ?
how can he change the command of God? even prophet muhammad > was > told you
cannot decide who goes to paradise or hell .let alone serign > bamba .but > >
serign bamba like many big scholars knew better .he never said to > ibra faal >
don't pray i will surfice you. he uses his scholarly mind to assess > ibra faal
> who was even telling mothers to make babies fast.> > why did the > mbye faal
cult emerge arround the person of ibra faal ?. a mad men > in africa > use to
have dreaded hears or locks .even in the gambia ,mad men's hear > > are > always
locks and unkempt. this was how ibra faal's head looks like. a symbol > > > of
madness .this is the same symbol the mbye faal imitate without properly > >
analysing why did he allow his hear to locks and be dreaded .> some people among
> the sufis in past use to also have locks call jimbo in > mandinka .there was a
> song to that effect .jimbo jimbe sanye balo ( a dread > locks that will never
be > shave off ). this sufi men would abandon living among > people ,they will
take > refuge in the forest and survive on fruits and things > like that. they
don't > combe their hears .> > the family or later ofsprings of seriegn Bamba
and some > his talibe's sons came > together to form a cult of sereign bamba and
the insane > ibra faal .they make up > all sorts of stories around the two
persons. ibra faal > cutting threes all day > and he missed asri salah ,so bamba
told him don't worry > about that i will > qaranttee you infron of God .all
lies. sereign bamba praying > on the river whilst > > transported to Gabon ,this
can't be verified.> the > maggal and the like are all money generating schemes
and to provide comfort > to > those ignorant folks.> all they are engaging in
Touba is shreik .bidah .why > can't sereign bamba's > offspring tell the mbye
faals the truth ?why can't they > advice the mbye faals to > > stop drinking
alcahol in the name of ibra faal ? > there are many simple questins > one can
ask the socall sheiks of Touba but if > one dear to ask them ,you may get > kill
for exposing their gran scam .it is so > sad what they are doing on the good >
name of sereign bamba .may his soul rest > in peace.amen.> i expect some
reactions. > ---------------------------------> > power only respect power.
there is a time to be hot and a time to be cool > > .(malcolm x ) Santanfara> >
> > United Arab Emirates> 1721 Posts> Posted - 17 > Jul 2007 : 11:33:46 >
---------------------------------> i may not have the time > to clarify the
dreadlocks issue later so let me do > > it now.> > i don't mean > dreadlocks is
a sign of madness in all circumstances .i mean in > many parts of > africa ,it
use to be a sign of madness. jimbo is the mandinka name > > for > dreadlocks
.some warrior fighters use to bread there hears and hide jujus > > underneath
them .the nyanchos and korings use to do that .> i also listen to the > story of
the black hat man in jamiaca who was known to be > the fisrt rasta man. > i
listen to burny wellars version of the story .i listen to > > the naration >
about 12 years ago. the song is call the black man ,but even in > burny wellars
> song he said ''people use to think that the black hat man was > mad''. i did
not > say that dread locks mean madness ,it use to mean that way in > long time
> ago.now it is symbol of fashion and life style not madness.> > >
---------------------------------> power only respect power. there is a time to
> be hot and a time to be cool > .(malcolm x ) Santanfara> > > > United Arab >
Emirates> 1721 Posts> Posted - 18 Jul 2007 : 10:44:11 > --------------------------------->
> interesting ,i didn't have any reactions . well i thought lemon time the >
mbye > faal would have attacked me. > ---------------------------------> power
only > respect power. there is a time to be hot and a time to be cool >
.(malcolm x ) > mansasulu> > > > 309 Posts> Posted - 19 Jul 2007 : 21:21:02 > >
---------------------------------> my brother, i think your observations to say
> the least are flawless > ---------------------------------> "...Verily, in the
> remembrance of Allâh do hearts find rest..." Sura Al-Rad > (Chapter 13, Verse
> 28)> > ...Gambian by birth, Muslim by the grace of Allah... Santanfara> > > >
> United Arab Emirates> 1721 Posts> Posted - 22 Jul 2007 : 23:52:04 > >
---------------------------------> thanks mansa , there are two sides to a coin
> .i hope some body will come > with another version so that we can debate in
the > making of the touba elites and > > the gang mbye falls >
---------------------------------> > power only respect power. there is a time
to be hot and a time to be cool > > .(malcolm x ) [input] Page: 1 2 3 4 of 4 > >
> Y Jallow <[log in to unmask]> > wrote:> > (Courtesy of Freedom Newspaper)> >
> http://www.freedomnewspaper.com/Homepage/tabid/36/mid/367/newsid367/2664/SENEGAL-THE-MURIDS-KHALIF-GENERAL-SERIGN-SALIOU-MBACKE-PASSES-AWAY/Default.aspx>
> > > Indeed, a great tree has fallen. May Almighty God be pleased with his
soul. > > Their father according to history was a very pious and gifted one. May
> Almighty > God be pleased with his soul-the late Amadou Bamba Ba. > > One
thing > that is not certain to me, whether they the succeeding caliphates of >
the great > Sheik Amadou Bamba Ba (May Allah Be Pleased with him) denounced the
> teachings > of their followers (talibehs)whose way is not conforming to the >
teachings of > the respected Bamba Ba (may Allah be pleased with him.)> > > Does
anyone here > know their stance on these talibehs locally known as >
"Mbai-Faals?"> > > Yero. > > > _________________________________________________________________>
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