> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paleolithic Eating Support List
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of steve
> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 1:04 PM
....
> There are so many assumptions here that it's hard to know where to
> start.  I don't buy into the assumptions you have made.  Firstly, I
> don't beleive that every has to eat paleo, or even most people.  Those
> of who choose to TRY to eat paleo is only a small fraction of the
> population, a very small fraction, and likely to be that way for a long
> long time, perhaps forever.  

Thanks for the response, Steve. Unfortunately, I don't have time to respond
to all the individual charges of assumptions I allegedly made, so I'll
summarize by saying I didn't make any of those assumptions. They appear to
be more like straw men that you set up to more easily knock down than the
points I actually made. I did not breathe life into any of those straw men,
nor did you, so they stand lifeless and can be ignored. 

We can move on to more constructive discussion of the actual topic at
hand--ideas for how we might move gradually and voluntarily toward a world
where more people have the option of choosing a semi-Paleo/ancestral diet
and lifestyle if they wish (vs. today's world where only a small minority
have that option). I'm not talking about returning to the exact way things
were 30,000 years ago, I'm talking about a world where more people have the
option to eat a diet similar to that in NeanderThin or The Paleo Diet and to
live in a somewhat more harmonious and sustainable way with nature,
recognizing that we will probably never give up modern technology
altogether. I'm trying to find reasonable, rational, constructive, positive
ideas here, not nightmarish totalitarian fantasies.

> I've no doubt that food can be formulated
> that provides the benefit of paleo, far in excess of our attempts to
> TRY
> to eat paleo.

Thanks for the constructive idea. I'll allow save any skepticism I might
have about it for a later day, if ever--I don't want to discourage
constructive suggestions right now and don't really have the time to get
into too much detail right now anyway.

> I don't have a problem with higher energy pricing because profits
> produce SOLUTIONS and high oil prices (which are artificially high
> because most of the world's oil is controlled by governments and oil
> lobbies promote policies and laws that restrict new energy entrants
> into
> the market place).

I agree with all of that. Well said. I was just paraphrasing a concern that
others had expressed here about what the rising energy costs they are
experiencing, and how lower population in the long run would reduce demand
for energy, and thus prices, independently of solutions/innovations, which
can provide additional or alternative energy sources and potentially
stabilize or even lower energy prices, as you suggested.

> Personally, and you can debate if this is "Paleo", but my next house
> will be more energy efficient, heated and cooled wight geothermal power
> which is completely FREE except for the cost of equipment which is
> decreasing quickly AND will have solar power with solar panel
> efficiency
> starting to improve on a cost per watt basis.  I would also like to
> capture my household's gray water with minimal processing for the
> landscaping and garden, an eatable landscaping I might add.

Cool. That's the sort of stuff I was imagining--greener homes and greener
industries. Does it look like it will be of reasonable economic cost for
you, or are you spending a lot more to be socially responsible?

> Then provide a modern alternative.  While fish farming does not produce
> equivalant output to wild caught options, this can be improved.
> Perhaps
> a new category like organic, wild farmed, could be introduced.  

Neat, I had thought about that possibility too.

> Choosing to TRY to eat paleo is an option everyone has.  Whether they
> can get anywhere near the variety necessary for a true paleo diet and
> want to  forage for hours every day is of cource their choice.

Well, not now it isn't an option for everyone, but maybe it will be an
option for everyone at some far future date, and how we might get there is
the main topic I was discussing. And again, I doubt anyone here thinks that
huge numbers of people are going to return to the precise diet and lifestyle
of hunter gatherers, where everyone hunts or gathers/forages nearly every
day. When people speak about the Paleo diet here, I think they generally
mean the sort of diet described in books like NeanderThin or The Paleo Diet
or The Paleolithic Prescription. Have you read any of those?