Phil,
I've always known that the children are the big difference in how we 
handle things, and I respect that.  I'm just wondering if, now that 
they are older, and better able to understand, if fuzzy boundaries 
are more confusing.  I don't know, maybe not.  I just wonder.
Kathy


At 12:03 PM 6/24/2006, you wrote:
>Kathy,
>
>Sandy and I have been discussing what we should do based on what is best for
>the children.  I had a talk with Gretchen recently which I have not
>described, or talked about, because it was just more of the same.  I also
>talked with a friend last night who had a meeting with Gretchen this week
>and he, independently, came up with the same conclusion.  That is, Gretchen
>is trying to be clean but not Christian.  So, in spite of the fact she seems
>to have been clean for three weeks, she still isn't interested in the Lord
>being the Lord of her life.  These meth people do want such from time to
>time but it lasts for a day or two and then you know the rest.  Trusting the
>Lord with Gretchen doesn't mean forsaking her but it does mean forgiving
>her.  In the process of forgiveness, however, that can mean some pretty
>serious decisions.  If there weren't children involved, it would make things
>a hundred times easier but everything we do has to take them into
>consideration and believe me, tossing a child's mother out is super hard.
>That aside, we have given Gretchen the chances we thought were necessary but
>now she has become a burden in more ways than one.  Meth addicts are users
>and they use everybody, including God, if they think they can get away with
>it.  In my decision, which I had actually already made before posting my
>question, and was confirmed by my friend and his private talk with Gretchen,
>we had a family talk with Gretchen which included her former husband who has
>custody of their 6 year old.  He wanted Sandy and I there as witnesses.  He
>was refusing to allow the 6 year old to stay all night with Gretchen based
>upon the fact she was taking Taylor with her to stay at her boyfriend's
>place.  As of this week, she is still, occasionally, not coming home at
>night.  So that made the decision for us.  I had already told her this last
>weekend but now, after my friend confirmed his opinion of her attitude, we
>are all in agreement about what has to be done.  Fortunately, Gretchen is
>still working but only because she works for her brother.  She has been
>turning her money over to him each week but she isn't turning her life over
>to the Lord and she isn't putting her children first.  What really breaks my
>heart is that there are people sitting in church pews every Sunday who have
>no different attitude than my daughter but they aren't on drugs.  The Lord
>showed this to me recently and it was very difficult to see.  It basically
>means more targeted prayer on my behalf.  It is clear now that Gretchen is
>striving to be clean until she is free of her diversionary program.  There
>is no doubt, once she is clear of that, she will go right back to the way
>she has been living.  I know what it is like to live without a parent.  My
>10 year old grandson only has his mom.  He has no father.  This slows down
>decision making procedures a great deal but Gretchen has made it clear she
>doesn't care about anything but making it through the program so no one can
>tell her what to do.  They are leaving today with my son and his family to
>go a couple of hours into the mountains to camp.  Gretchen won't have any
>access to anyone with drugs.  It will be interesting to see how she makes it
>because they are camping on private land in the middle of no where.
>
>Phil.