Pat,
No no no no nonononono. You did nothing wrong. The post was fine. Jesus was
our substitute. What I was saying, which I apparently didn't do too great a
job saying is, wouldn't it be terrible if we found out in the rapture that
Christ, taking our place in eternal separation from the Father occurred. In
other words, as un biblical as it is, it makes one think of the severity of
our sin and the grace involved if we were to envision us standing in front
of the Father with Christ at his right hand, and then the Father commanding
Christ to spend eternity without the Father right in front of us because of
the sin he bore for us, and we'd never be able to spend it with Christ as
well. My thought and envision is the un biblical part, not your post. It
was merely a thought extension that popped in my head that really brought
to more light the severity of our sin, the sacrifice the Father and Jesus
made, and the grace and mercy involved. It was sort of a quirky thought.
You did nothing wrong Pat.
Brad
At 12:50 PM 2/12/2006 -0600, you wrote:
>Hi Brad,
>
>Wow! I didn't see that in the post about Jesus being a substitute,
>but I do believe you.
>
>I'm sorry about that, I guess I should have red it more carefully
>before sending it.
>
>Jesus is not a substitute for our sins, and He is Allmighty and All
>things good and I didn't realize it was unBiblical. Sorry about that.
>
>We are responsible for our own actions, not Jesus. I'm sorry I sent it.
><smile>
>
>Thanks for calling it to my attention. <smile>
>
>Blessings,
>Pat Ferguson
>
>At 04:41 PM 2/11/2006, you wrote:
> >Pat,
> >
> >Romans 8:28 is one of my fav scriptures. You know though as I read this
> >the word "propitiation" with its meaning of substitute and responsibility
> >hit me like a ton of bricks as I visualized something that to me
> >seems horrible to me. As your post said that Jesus was the substitute
> >taking our responsibility for our sins, and I know, well, at least I think
> >I know this wouldn't happen, but it sure puts things in perspective if you
> >think on it. Imagine we as sinners are doomed to death, eternity without
> >God. But in come Christ who takes our place. We think of that as very
> >noble, very sacrificial and all and yet we picture Christ seated at the
> >right hand of the Father and etc. And this has no Biblical merit that I'm
> >aware of but by rights without grace I suppose it would be in order.
> >Imagine if when we die, stand before God, you know at the rapture, and
> >God reaches over to His right and tosses Jesus to eternal separation.
> >Imagine after all he did for us and it was our sin that he took final
> >responsibility for that did that? Granted that isn't going to happen, but
> >that I believe is what happened when he died for us. I don't think we will
> >know the full significance of the sacrifice until we meet up with God in
> >the end.
> >
> >Brad
> >
> >at
> >
> >At 03:41 PM 2/11/2006 -0600, you wrote:
> > >Hi Loving Ones,
> > >
> > >
> > >Know that you are all precious and sweet, and made out of love, full
> > >of love, and so very loving! That is how God looks at us and that is
> > >how I see my loving ones, all of you.
> > >
> > >I really love this. This is how we should look at Valentine's Day.
> > >
> > >Please read below.
> > >
> > >Love you,
> > >Pat Ferguson
> > >
> > >
> > > >>Thoughts about Valentine's Day
> > > >>
> > > >>February 14th is Valentine's Day. Valentine's Day is a day
> > > >>whenever people recognize those they love. It's a day for
> > > >>examining the wonderful benefits of loving someone. What benefits
> > > >>are there when a person chooses to love God.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>1) (Rom 8:28) And we know that all things work together for
> > > >>good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to
> > > >>his purpose.
> > > >>
> > > >>a) Reward. If a person chooses to love God there is a great
> > > >>reward. The reward is not that all things will be good but that
> > > >>all things, good and bad, put together will come out for good in
> the end.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>2) (1Co 8:3) But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
> > > >>
> > > >>a) Recognition. The Bible says that if any person will choose
> > > >>to love God that that person will be known by God. The Word known
> > > >>in the Bible is a special Word. It implies not just knowledge
> > > >>about a person but intimacy with that person. If we will choose to
> > > >>love God God wants to know us and wants us to have an intimate
> > > >>relationship with him and He with us
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>3) (1Jo 4:10) Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that
> > > >>he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.
> > > >>
> > > >>a) Realizations. There are realizations to those that love
> > > >>God. First, that God is pretty easy to love. Secondly, that we
> > > >>are pretty hard to love. Thirdly that even when we have done so
> > > >>many things wrong that God would send his only son to die for
> > > >>us. John uses the word propitiation here. Fancy word right! That
> > > >>word means two things ; substitute and taking the responsibility
> > > >>for. Jesus became our substitute. He died in our place. Not only
> > > >>that but he took the responsibility and punishment for our sins so
> > > >>that when we stand in front of God it is as if we have done no
> > > >>wrong. Jesus was the propitiation. God's anger with us over our
> > > >>sin was satisfied in what Jesus did. When we realize this we can
> > > >>stand before God "just-as-if-I'd" (justified) never done anything
> > > >>wrong, it is a wonderful realizations and proof that God loves us.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>4) (1Jo 4:20) If a man say, I love God, and hateth his
> > > >>brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he
> > > >>hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
> > > >>
> > > >>a) Responsibility. God not only loves you. He loves every
> > > >>other person in this world. We have a responsibility to love those
> > > >>that he loves. We should love them in tangible ways because
> > > >>actions speak louder than words alone.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>5) (1Jo 5:2) By this we know that we love the children of
> > > >>God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
> > > >>
> > > >>a) Reciprocity. Sorry for the fancy word. Reciprocity means
> > > >>an equal balance or exchange. If we love God and obey the Word of
> > > >>God, we will love the people of God and his church. If we do not, we
> > > do not.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>Happy Valentine's Day and know this day that of all the people that
> > > >>love you, God loves you most.
> >
> >Brad
> >
> > Inside an acorn lies an entire forest
Brad
Make it idiot-proof and someone will make a better idiot
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