Ken, et al,
I know this started off as a funny, but this Ken's fellow Ken's talking
about really started a firestorm of discussion in the military
community. Here's some background on the fellow from the wire service:
"Keith Kerr, retired Colonel., U.S. Army; retired Brigadier General,
California National Reserve, who submitted a question about gays in the
military, is a member of Hillary Clinton's 'Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and
Transexual Americans For Hillary' Steering Committee. He's also part of
a film production crew trying overturn the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell"
policy."
From his bio on Servicemembers Legal Defense Network where he is on the
Military Advisory Council:
"He retired from the U. S. Army Reserve in 1986 with the rank of Colonel
and was commissioned in the California State Military Reserve
(California National Guard) on 15 March 1986, where his assignments were
Inspector Generaland later, Chief of Staff. He was appointed Commanding
General, Northern Area Command, CSMR, with headquarters at Alameda Naval
Supply Depot, Alameda, CA and promoted to Brigadier General on 21
February 1991. He held this position until reassigned to State
Headquarters on 31 July 1995. General Kerr retired on 1 June 1996 after
43 years of service to the United States and the State of California."
"Don't Ask, Don't Tell" was one of the worst edicts to come out of the
Clinton White House. In a misguided attempt to help the cause of gay
folks in the military, it actually forced many out of the system. There
have always been bunches of gays in the military--especially since the
integration of women into Combat Support and Combat Service Support
teams.
Prior to DADT, nobody cared because gay folks steered themselves toward
the services and jobs that were under the radar. DADT was unofficially
in place long before the law was passed. Used to be, when a kid wanted
out of his/her enlistment contract they would go to their CO and say, "I
want to quit, so I'm gay--you need to put me out." They'd get a
"General Discharge under Honorable Conditions" and that was it. NOW
there has to be an investigation and the CO has to determine if there
was sexual activity and who the partner was. Say you have two lesbians
in a relationship and one wants leave before her commitment is up. If
she goes to the CO, then that commander has to verify the act(s) and if
they were with another soldier. The other soldier, who wants to stay
in, has to testify under oath whether or not she had a sexual
relationship with the other soldier. Either way, both of their military
careers are shot and they may get discharged under "Less That Honorable
Conditions". You can't use your veteran status for job seeking at that
point. In these cases the soldier who wants to leave will be strongly
advised to Chapter 15 out on "Drug and Alcohol" issues with a General
Discharge. DADT is a screwed-up law that never needed to be there in
the first place.
I saw the debate live and was embarrassed by GEN Kerr's grandstanding.
It was very awkward and certainly did nothing to help the gay community.
On top of that, if he WAS gay during his time in service and committed a
sexual act prohibited by the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ),
then he should have his retirement package revoked. This has happened
to numerous officers who have committed adultery while in service
(adultery is another act prohibited by the UCMJ).
Kyle
-----Original Message-----
From: Cerebral Palsy List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf
Of ken barber
Sent: Saturday, December 08, 2007 9:56 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: what would you do?
you know i wonder why the question on that came up in
the GOP debate when "don't ask, don't tell" was/is a
clinton policy. the clinton news network picked the
question and flew the guy from florida and it was all
coincidence? i was borned at night, but not last
nignt.
--- "Kendall D. Corbett" <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:
> But if some of the CG enlistees were gay or lesbian,
> how would that be
> viewed under "don't ask, don't tell," which is newly
> under fire?
>
> On 12/8/07, Tamar Raine <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> >
> > well, then some would be gay or lesbian, and one
> would be transexual! lol!
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > http://www.zazzle.com/TamarMag*
> > Tamar Mag Raine
> > [log in to unmask]
> > www.cafepress.com/tamarmag
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Deri James <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Sent: Saturday, December 8, 2007 3:47:02 AM
> > Subject: Re: what would you do?
> >
> > On Saturday 08 December 2007 02:22:55 Tamar Raine
> wrote:
> > > I say let them party! lol! it's only a one hour
> flight!
> > >
> >
> > Yeah, you're right - but I think the airline would
> have to set up a rota,
> > there were 17 females and 25 males!!
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Deri
> >
> >
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > http://www.zazzle.com/TamarMag*
> > > Tamar Mag Raine
> > > [log in to unmask]
> > > www.cafepress.com/tamarmag
> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----
> > > From: ken barber <[log in to unmask]>
> > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > Sent: Friday, December 7, 2007 10:45:58 AM
> > > Subject: what would you do?
> > >
> > > Fasten Seat Belts
> > >
> > > Flying to Los Angeles from San Francisco the
> other
> > > day, a passenger noticed that the "Fasten Seat
> Belts"
> > > sign was kept lit during the whole journey
> although
> > > the flight was a particularly smooth one.
> > >
> > > Just before landing, he asked the stewardess
> about it.
> > >
> > >
> > > "Well," she explained, "up front there are 17
> > > University of California girls going to Los
> Angeles
> > > for the weekend.
> > >
> > > "In back, there are 25 Coast Guard enlistees.
> What
> > > would you do?"
> > >
> >
> > -----------------------
> >
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> >
>
>
> --
>
>
> Kendall
>
> An unreasonable man (but my wife says that's
> redundant!)
>
> The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the
> unreasonable one
> persists in trying to adapt the world to himself.
> Therefore, all progress
> depends on the unreasonable man.
>
> -George Bernard Shaw 1856-1950
>
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