Hi Ken,
I do not understand the ostrich attitude to Global Warming. You seem to be
saying that GW is solely due because "the sun is going thru a hotter
cycle" (I'm not sure whether you are referring to the normal 11yr sunspot
activity, or the Milankovitch Effect (slight changes in orbit)). Whilst there
is slight correlation with historical climactic conditions it is insufficient
to explain those changes. If you wish a more academic source (and I wouldn't
trust what I say - I'm Welsh!!) have a look at:-
<http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/info/causecc/>
Another interesting source of info is at:-
<http://amap.no/acia/>
(It's quite a large PDF but well written, authorative, and generally erring on
the conservative side in its conclusions).
Whether Kyoto would have made a significant difference is another argument,
one which can't be proved either way because one country (the richest and
dirtiest polluter) turned its back on the world for essentially selfish
reasons.
I also do not understand why it is assumed that the only way to reduce petrol
prices is to increase production (again, selfishly, using up a finite
resource even quicker). Surely the law of Supply and Demand equally states
that if demand falls then so will prices. (Think how much fossil fuel is used
making electricity - this "demand" increases oil/gas prices). It is kind of
ironic the Dubya (the "friend" of oil interests) says "Make fewer car
journeys" and his people say "No - Cut Taxes" (bearing in mind US still has
lowest gas prices in the Western World!!). Prices in the UK are about $6.90 a
us gallon (and our wages are lower than yours).
Cheers
Deri
On Tuesday 06 Sep 2005 04:57, ken barber wrote:
> oh, crap the new orleam times piciune has gotten
> award after award writing series of articles after
> series predicting this would happen just as it did for
> years and years. it is pure bs that natural buffers
> were took away. the fact is that the damn city was 20
> foot below sea level.
> go out in your back yard and dig a hole. put in a
> bucket of water. it fills up. that, mag, is what
> happened. new orleans was built in a hole and katrina
> filled up the hole.
> that should be a simple enough illistration for
> everyone to understand.
> it is so wet down there that they can't even bury
> anybody. wet lands drained, my arse. oh, have we
> noticed the temps being up, has anyone noticed that
> the sun is going thru a hotter cycle, more solor
> flares? it has been reported. yes the temps are up.
> becouse the sun is hotter. KYOTO, HAD NOTHING TO DO
> WITH THIS. just like in the 30's and 40's when we got
> this kind of cycle and we got the hurricanes then too.
> how the hell could that have happened? george bush was
> not even born yet. BY THE WAY THE ICE BURGS WERE DOING
> THE SAME THING THEY ARE DOING NOW. don't anybody study
> history anymore? maybe the question should be does
> anybody teach history any more? does anyone know why
> greenland was named greenland. IT WAS GREEN WHEN IT
> WAS NAMED, NOT WHITE. AS IT IS NOW.
>
> i also find it hard to believe that gov. blanco did
> nothing but whine like the mayor did that somebody
> else was not doing something like they forgot they
> were elected mayor and governor. she forgot she
> commanded her national guard, she forgot she was the
> one to order a evacuation, she forgot she commanded
> the state police, she fortgot to execute a plan. the
> mayor forgot he was elected and commanded the city
> police, he let school busses that were just parked
> stay parked that could be used to help those with no
> cars get out. it is not like they were going to have
> school in the middle of a storm. he forgot that there
> was a noted criminal element in his city and he thinks
> they will just cease to be criminals, maybe he just
> forgot he had a brain to use.
>
> hell yes the mayor failed and so did governor blanco.
> then on top of that the feds failed. FEMA FAILED, THE
> DEPT OF HOMELAND SECURITY FAILED. THANK G-D FOR THE
> US. MILITARY.
> the whole system failed.
> the governors and legislatures and the president and
> congress had better fix the system. there may well be
> terrorist bringing in a wreapon of mass destruction as
> i write, there may be another monster storm brewing in
> the atlantic, los angeles or san fran can have a
> catstrophic earthquake, and let's not forget TSUNAMIS
> can hit our coast too.
> our elected officials at every level had better fix
> the system becouse the system failed at every level.
>
>
> give me a break. every body go out tommorrow and dig
> the hole and pour water in it and report back if the
> hole magically could not be filled up. until then i'll
> turn off the computer and get a nights sleep and cool
> down.
>
> sorry for the explosion.
>
> --- Magenta Raine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > Ken,
> > I don't know. It sure looks like business interests
> > helped cause Katrina,
> > in that businesses in LA drained so much of the
> > wetlands that it took away
> > that natural buffer there. It sure looks like water
> > surface temps had a
> > lot to do with how much stronger there hurricanes
> > are getting.
> >
> > I find it hard to believe that the governor did not
> > know she had to request
> > the natl guard assistance, but you are correct in
> > that blame is
> > everywhere, from the senators and congress folks who
> > would not ratify kyoto
> > agreement even though Clinton signed it, to the
> > states of LA and Mis. who
> > did not have plans - and also did not have the
> > sense to do a state tax to
> > help pay for things when feds said see your money go
> > to homeland
> > security...
> >
> > many of those who stayed behind were those who are
> > the elderly poor or
> > disabled poor... How were they supposed to leave the
> > area? AND why was it
> > that when a non-flooded area offered to help, the
> > feds said no thanks.
> > there are just so many stories of help that was
> > offered but turned down.
> >
> > Mag
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > [log in to unmask]
> > If you need a business card designed, please email
> > me.
> >
> > > [Original Message]
> > > From: ken barber <[log in to unmask]>
> > > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > > Date: 9/5/2005 7:42:57 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Fw: Here's an article on the
> >
> > preparedness of FEMA.
> >
> > > dear mag, they can put an oil well in now that you
> > > could not find if you did not know where it was.
> > > hydrogen cars are a good 20 years to feasably
> >
> > being
> >
> > > sold to the public. electric cars are good for
> >
> > short
> >
> > > range local driving if you hold down the mileage.
> >
> > the
> >
> > > hybrids on the market now is the best bet if they
> >
> > can
> >
> > > get them down a little so that most average people
> >
> > can
> >
> > > aford them.
> > > the idea that business men ant to poison the air
> >
> > and
> >
> > > water that they and their kids have to breath and
> > > drink just like everybody else is irrational.
> > > i am saying taxes are a big part of the price of
> > > gas. if the government can do anything quickly
> >
> > about
> >
> > > the high prices, that is it. if you don't want
> >
> > prices
> >
> > > to come down, then leave it alone. you know if gas
> > > keeps going up, your food is going to go up, your
> >
> > mass
> >
> > > transit will go up, you name your consumer
> >
> > products
> >
> > > and the cost og fuel will affect it. if you do not
> > > want the only quick fix the government can effect,
> > > then don't critisize any of them from bush down.
> > > long term we are going to have to quit listening
> >
> > to
> >
> > > irrational groups and build refineries, drill for
> >
> > oil,
> >
> > > build nuclear power plants and other things.
> > > by the way if you want to put the drilling in
> >
> > anwar
> >
> > > in prospective the 2000 acres where drilling is
> > > proposed compared to all of anwar would be like a
> > > postage stamp on your average living room floor.
> >
> > and
> >
> > > it is not pristime wilderness, it is a danm sheet
> >
> > of
> >
> > > ice, contrary to what the media portrays.
> > > like i said this fuel crises now is showing the
> >
> > pure
> >
> > > folly of the politics of the last 20 years or so.
> >
> > and
> >
> > > like i said some of us saw it comming.
> > >
> > > --- Magenta Raine <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > > it is my understanding that companies have been
> > > > buying up patents for
> > > > alternative energy vehicles but have not yet put
> > > > them on market because
> > > > they want to squeeze every drop of oil money
> >
> > they
> >
> > > > can. So I am not sure if
> > > > drilling for our own oil and messing up the
> > > > environment is the thing to do.
> > > > They are waiting too damn long to put these alt.
> > > > vehicles on market.
> > > >
> > > > My question is, why are you saying roll back
> >
> > the
> >
> > > > gas tax??
> > > >
> > > > mag
> > > >
> > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > > [log in to unmask]
> > > > If you need a business card designed, please
> >
> > email
> >
> > > > me.
> > > >
> > > > > [Original Message]
> > > > > From: ken barber <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > > Date: 9/5/2005 2:51:32 PM
> > > > > Subject: Re: Fw: Here's an article on the
> > > >
> > > > preparedness of FEMA.
> > > >
> > > > > our governor removed state tax from gas here
> >
> > in
> >
> > > > > georgia, write your governor and ask that nc
> >
> > do
> >
> > > > the
> > > >
> > > > > same. by the way i was in north carolina this
> > > >
> > > > morning
> > > >
> > > > > and could have filled up at 3.19.
> > > > > write your congressman and senators and remove
> >
> > the
> >
> > > > > federal tax on gas.
> > > > >
> > > > > but, of course there is a gas shortage. there
> >
> > was
> >
> > > > a
> > > >
> > > > > short supply before the storm. roughly 25 per
> >
> > cent
> >
> > > > of
> > > >
> > > > > the countries energy comes from the gulf
> >
> > coast.
> >
> > > > > refineries are under water. we have not built
> >
> > a
> >
> > > > new
> > > >
> > > > > refinery since 1975. most of the refineries
> >
> > were
> >
> > > > > running at near capicity so those left can't
> >
> > take
> >
> > > > up
> > > >
> > > > > the slack. this just points up the folly of
> >
> > not
> >
> > > > > drilling for our own oil and building our
> > > >
> > > > capacity.
> > > >
> > > > > the very folly of the politics that has
> >
> > blocked
> >
> > > > this
> > > >
> > > > > for years. some of us saw it comming.
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Kathy <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> > > > > > We're feeling the effects here in NC too,
> >
> > Bobby
> >
> > > > -
> > > >
> > > > > > there is a gas shortage
> > > > > > here. too, and I even saw that a gas station
> > > >
> > > > down
> > > >
> > > > > > East was charging $4.65 a
> > > > > > gallon!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Kat
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Saturday 03 September 2005 3:53 pm, you
> > > >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > What you are not seeing on national TV are
> >
> > the
> >
> > > > > > collateral problems. For
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > instance, the entire city of Memphis is
> >
> > out of
> >
> > > > > > gasoline! I just talked to a
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > lady from Baton Rogue and they have a
> >
> > curfew
> >
> > > > > > because of rape and gunfire.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > It doesn't take Einstein to realize to
> >
> > ripple
> >
> > > > > > effect re: pipelines, etc
>
> === message truncated ===
>
>
>
>
>
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