Lelia, I remember from school, in church history classes, that some guy
named Certulian said, that the seed of the church is the blood of the martyrs.

earlier, lelia, wrote:
>Hi all, this might sound weird but oh well here goes anyway.
>
>I just had to share this.  I am studying the book of Daniel and  am just
>reading how each king that Daniel is under basically has to be shown that
>God is who He is.  Well, in our bible study we are studying the book of Job.
>Well, in our church there is this guy who just well, its sad but he is
>thinking of us as God and Satan's pawns and Job is one of them too.  Well, I
>finally get the picture I think and if I am wrong please let me know.  Ok,
>Adam and Eve s
>
>Ok adam and Eve sinned ok got it, Now when God called Abraham he told
>Abraham that he would kmake him a father of nations or many right?  Right.
>Then we have the israelites who just couldn't get it they would sin and God
>would deliver them but through there sins people saw there sin and how God
>delivered them, that was part of the world seeing God's mercies.  Ok so we
>have all the judges and kings and trials of Israel but the world is seeing
>all of what is going on with Israel and what Israels God is doing to and for
>and with them.  Get it?  So God through the Israelites is showing the world
>of his awesomeness.  His power what He can do.  Then we have characters like
>David and Moses who sin but God loves them and He forgives them so there we
>have God's forgiveness.  I remember Christ was saying how you can't
>understand the old testament because and if I'm saying this wrong forgive me
>but something like that God seemed cruel.  No, He's not, he is loving and
>forgiving but He is a father too and what does a father do but discipline
>you.  Ok so I digress sorry.  So we have David who is a man after God's own
>heart David commits sins but David is a big part of the line of Jesus wow.
>I'm still with Israel here, we have the prophets saying to them come on guys
>get with the picture or your in trouble then the israelites are captured and
>go to Babylon and then there is Daniel who is favoured with men and God and
>through Daniel God shows who and what He can do,He helps Daniel interpret
>dreams and stuff like that.  Then we go forward to Jesus birth death and
>resurection.  Jesus gets his disciples and what do those disciples and
>apostles do?  They go into all the world preaching and teaching the gospel
>and here we are.  I guess my point is that if the Israelites hadn't sinned
>if Job hadn't questioned God if Jesus hadn't been born died and arose again
>we wouldn't have known.  I guess I am saying I see God's reasons for doing
>what He did.  You even have the martyrs who through there faith died and
>spread christianity through there faith.  Gosh I know what I'm trying to say
>and maybe its just rambling to you all but I hope to someone it will make
>some sense.
>
>Lelia

John

   Save a tree, kill a beaver