> Joan McPhee <[log in to unmask]>
>  Subject: Re:

>  Yes, you are right.  Beta blocking drugs are not considered antithyroid
>  drugs per-se (in that they do not inhibit synthesis or secretion of thyroid
>  hormones by the thyroid gland).  Continued use for patients taking T3
>  however depletes excess T3 from the body very rapidly.
So, I think you're saying, that someone who is hypothryoid is likely to have
high blood pressure.  Even if they are not hypothyroid but there is some
other cause the doctor didn't bother to figure out by the time the doctors
are done the person will be on beta blockers, the doctor will tell them it's
probably for the rest of their life, and because doctors don't believe in the
theory that anything could cause a problem with T4 turning into T3, the docs
won't give anyone T3 to compensate for the loss so a normal person develops
hypothyroidism and doesn't have a clue why, and a hypo person becomes even
more hypo because the doctor won't increase the thryoid meds the patient was
wanting to increase before the beta blocker.

It seems to me when I was on a beta blocker shortly when my doctor initially
prescribed Synthroid and did so with too large a dose, she told me that
fatigue was one of the side effects.  The suppression of Thyroid explains it.


Strayze <[log in to unmask]>
>To my knowledge beta blockers do not suppress the thyroid gland per se and
i>ts production of thyroid hormone.  Beta blockers are prescribed for high
>blood pressure, to slow down tachyarrhythmia, and to suppress certain but
>not all SYMPTOMS of thyrotoxicity (only the adrenergic symptoms of high
>blood pressure, tachyarrhthmia), whether it be endogenous or iatrogenic.
Hmmm..  That would certainly be a good trick.  I'm not denying it's possible,
but it seems unlikely to me that it can slow down the heart rate and still
not affect the energy level.  Anyway, other than the rapid heart rate and
increased blood pressure, I'm not really aware of any other signs of
thyrotoxicity.  I was wondering for example how one would get osteoporosis, a
problem with throtoxicosis if the heart wasn't escalated so I went to Thyroid
Manager at "http://www.thyroidmanager.org/chapter13/ch%2D13%2D3.htm" and
searched for it.  It says, "Long-term use of suppressive amounts of thyroid
hormone has been reported to enhance osteoporosis and also cause cardiac
abnormalities including arrhythmias and function disturbances.  but other
studies have not confirmed these findings."  In my case I'm not smart enough
to go find these studies and evaluate methods used to come to the conclusion
whether or not it does.  In your case you probably are.

My opinion at the current time is if only the effect on the heart is
mitigated by the beta blocker, this will do a lot of harm.  First, if one was
on adequate thyroid meds the blood pressure might go down to normal.  My
wife's was high on 100mcg of Synthroid but not when she was on 18 grains of
Armour.  Yes, her pulse was over 100 and her blood pressure would have been
treated shortly by the doctor who said if she wouldn't go on a beta blocker
she would have to find a new doctor, fortunately we took her to Doc Don.
The beta blocker became unnecessary.  Secondly, seeing hypothyroidism as a
system problem, a lot of the difficulties are related to the circulatory
system.  While hypo your heart is weak and therefore cannot circulate blood
well enough to provide the oxygen the body needs.  This causes hands to turn
blue, causes muscles that need oxygen and don't get enough to be sore, I
don't know much about nerves, but if nerves need oxygen provided by the blood
flow that may be the reason for neuropathy in some cases.  Someone might
start yawning a lot, when they get older they may have to carry around oxygen
because the circulatory system it so weak from the low thyroid.  Everyone
knows about brain fog, could that be a lack of oxygen from the blood that
goes to the brain?

Furthermore, hasn't Doc Don and the studies told us that beta blockers lower
blood pressure, but do not increase life expectancy?  No wonder, it's a way
to keep hypo people hypo.  A  way to treat symptoms by making sure you still
have them.

Propranlol says it increases lab levels of T4 and lowers levels of T3.
Wonder how many doctors treating patients using this drug are aware of this.
If T4 levels are up, TSH may very well be suppressed and the doctor hasn't a
clue without looking at the T3.  The literature also says it increases
reverse T3, thus it appears someone on this should be taking a T3 product.
If they are not, if just getting Synthroid then they only get T4.  As far as
I know T4 has no benefit until it turns into T3 so once again the doctors
have found a placebo way to tell patients, "but I'm treating your thyroid,
your TSH and T4 are excellent, it's something else so why don't you get a
physical and keep up the monthly visits so I can buy my new yacht."

Those responsible for spreading the misinformation about thyroid disorder and
treatment certainly do spin a pretty good web to get us tangled up in.  No
wonder they attack Dr. Derry and others who want to help us get out of their
grip.

Skipper Beers


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