Rex: >No, no, no---I have NOT said fruitaria-whatever can work under any particular >conditions. I have said that *you* cannot claim it won't work until you factor in >all variables, including quality. Any burden of proof is on you, not me. Tom: And I have presented proof of quality, which you stubbornly and blindly refuse to accept. Rex: >And I have not, to my knowledge, claimed that any particular toxicity was present in >your long-ago food. Instead, I wondered about the possibility and I was trying to >illustrate with a few toxic cases that I have heard of. Tom: You fantasized about it, you rationalized about it. Time to face reality and to accept that high brix cannot guarantee success on fruitarian or 100% raw vegan. Rex: >You saying you're >sure there was none means little unless you've got a test saying so. Produce some >results and settle this because there's no profit to me to carry it further. >You seem so utterly adamant that you were getting high-quality food and I've hinted >mightily that a bit of proof might be in order. I have shared my experiences about Tom: My organic garden was on land that was cleared separately, after our home was built. No dumping by us or anyone else, to our knowledge. Your demand for tests is just a red herring - a diversion. Your approach to this is issue is dishonest, warped and twisted. Rex: >My points on this forum are attacked sometimes as repetitive and boring but, from my >viewpoint it is quite boring to be everlastingly advised that fruit-eating is a no-no >because *you* had a personal failure. Tom: It's not just me who did not succeed on fruitarianism. I have stated repeatedly that I have examined many so-called success claims and found that the individual was one of: 1) not strict (i.e., non-vegan, eats some cooked, etc.), 2) not long-term, 3) not following the diet as claimed, 4) not credible - emaciated and/or seriously mentally unbalanced. And indeed you are boring: you are obsessed with brix, and fail to realize that your focus on brix is narrow minded and misleading. If you don't like this forum, I'm sure your rationalizations and excuses for the ongoing failure of raw vegan and fruitarian regimes, would be welcome over on the crank science Forum. As raw vegan diets are usually a failure in the long-term, those folks need all the rationalizations they can find to help prop up their bogus crank science theories. Rex: >A lack of certified quality is a *big* hole in this ship. Tom: And your assumption that you can focus only on brix and ignore the needs of the body, is a massive logical fallacy. Rex: >Your >hostility may be showing through in a few of your recent posts and I would appreciate >it being directed toward your enemies---which I surely ain't. Tom: You attack me every chance you get. You appear to go out of your way to attack me. You twist and distort my statements to attack me. Your claims above are simply more of your twisted dishonesty. Rex: >I know not you---nor your adversaries---but I highly suspect that the confused muddle >that passes for thinking here would bode ill for any livestock if the posters were in >charge of their nutrition. Tom: Your focus on brix, ignoring the body's nutritional needs, is certainly muddled thinking. Rex: >I trust you'll notice after a day or so that I don't intend to respond to your post >that attempts to justify how calling people names is not really calling people >names. Seems to me that name-calling, no matter how eloquent the rationalizations, >is a down-hill trip. Tom: Cranks are cranks, fakes are fakes, and so on. Your effort to twist reality and designate it as "name-calling" simply illustrates clearly that you continue to refuse to face reality. Indeed, your claim above is simply another twisted rationalization by you. Rex, you simply cannot stand it when people challenge your assumptions and twisted rationalizations. As I mentioned above, you might be happier on another forum - one where your assumptions and rationalizations about the ongoing long-term failure of raw vegan, are welcome. Here on this forum - the only honest raw forum - your assumptions are open to challenge. Tom Billings