Denis said:
>A certain OSHAWA said the same thing fifty years ago. I don't know
>how recent a discovery is the argument of the similitude of
>proteins... But basically what the founder of macrobiotics said was
>that, as far as RAF is concerned, we are necessarily more adapted to
>the oldest species than to the newest ( he used it as an argument to
>exclude red meat from macro but to >accept fish as a source of protein
>). This made much sense to me even before I became an instincto.
>Personally I eat mammal meat once or twice in the year. An attitude
>which, I guess, gives me some affinity with the vegans which were
>thrown out of the list earlier on...

Since man began to eat fish only quite late in his development - about
40.000 years ago - this argument does not seem to hold water.

Denis said:
>Hoping this improvised message meets with your expectations of sound
>contribution.

Many fold! Your response to " Fatigue in instinctive nutrition" was
excellent. I look forward to following your attempts to innovate
instinctive nutrition.

Jean-Louis said:
>3:00 p.m.: conference with Burger, questions/answers (I'll report
>about it in separate posts). He seems rather bright, and more
>open-minded than the average long-time instincto.

Thanks for sharing your experience of your weekend at Montrame. I look
forward to hearing more about the Q & A with Burger.

Jean-Louis said:
>An instincto-style diet can be, IMO, the most efficient of raw diets,
>but is also the most difficult one. Following the instinct to regulate
>the quantities is indeed an attractive idea, but before one becomes
>self-disciplined enough not to overeat fruits and one is able to eat a
>wide variety of vegetables with relish, many years of uncertainty and
>mistakes can pass, during which the pleasure level has ups and downs.

You are hitting the issue right on the nail. So long as self-discipline
remains a dirty word among instinctos and the pleasure principle is
allowed to reign without any restriction, instincto will not grow out
of its childhood. Instinctive eaters are clearly above average in
intelligence but IMO nevertheless examples of lonely and neglected
children needing instant gratification, refusing to grow up and face
the complexities of the world.

Jean-Louis said:
>My (humble) opinion: since carrots contain something like 90% water,
>5% sugar and 5% starch+fibers+proteins+..., eating 1 carrot is
>equivalent to 1-2 pieces of sugar. Moreover, if it is not eaten alone,
>its digestion will be slowed down, so I don't think you should worry
>too much about it.

It is not the amount of sugar as such that determines the glycemic
rating of a food but the speed at which it gets broken down and enters
the blood. Eating high glycemic foods like carrots with other foods
will sometimes do the trick depending on the sensitivity of the person
and the proportion and nature of the other foods eaten.

Jean-Louis said:
>I don't think natural "toxemia" is generated by radiations alone.
> *natural phytotoxins do exist, some may even be carcinogenic. The
>assumption that the body is able to handle them perfectly seems a bit
>utopic. In Nature, there is a natural balance between predators and
>preys; preys do survive long enough to reproduce, but their average
>lifespan would certainly be higher without predators...

As this in the long run would weaken the gene pool, I am not sure how
big an advantage a world without predators would be for the prey.


Jean-Louis said:
>>Could enzymes pre-digest food in the upper stomach before they are
>>destroyed?

Tom said:
>That is certainly a posibility. Gabriel Cousens claims that is exactly
>what happens in digestion.  A related point here is that we don't chew
>our food completely, and digestion is not 100% efficient, so some
>enzymes will survive the trip through the stomach. However, we don't
>know if the amount that survives is of any importance in digestion.

Proponents of enzymatic therapies claim to have shown through
radioactive tracing that supplemental enzymes make it all the way into
the our organs & blood stream.

Tom said:
> Further, algae and spirulina supplements are usually dead; they are
>raw but also dead (from freeze drying).

I think calling freeze-dried algae "dead" is an overstatement.

>* In a number of talks, Viktoras has claimed that B vitamin shortages
>are due to overeating and flatulence. Specifically, overeating causes
>fermentation and changes the intestinal flora - i.e., the B-vitamin
>producing bacteria cannot thrive, and flatulence has a similar effect.
>By bringing your eating back to the correct level, the intestinal
>flora will soon adjust and B vitamin producing bacteria will thrive
>again. (The topic of producing B12 within your intestines and colon is
>controversial; the bacteria are there but there is no hard proof
>that you can absorb it, as the B-12 receptor sites are upstream in the
>digestive tract.)

Interesting information.

>If you go to an M.D. and have a blood B12 level test done, they will
>take a blood sample and do a microbial assay - a bacterial culture.
>Reportedly, this type of test is not very reliable. One also wonders
>whether such a test might be unreliable if conducted on a 100%
>raw/live fooder.  The reason is that raw/live food diets enhance your
>immune system greatly. Your blood is clearly alive, and it is still
>alive when it is taken from you and put into culture. The point here
>is that the blood from a raw/live fooder is likely to be a very
>unfriendly environment for bacteria - due to strong immune system and
>possibly different pH (more alkaline?).

As I understand it a strong immune system means having strong
beneficial bacterial cultures in the acidic environment of our guts. If
a raw vegan diet creates an inner environment that is alkaline,
consequently unfriendly bacteria will proliferate.

>B12 deficiency is seen as a digestive disorder, specifically caused by
>lack of a certain type of agni or digestive fire. If not corrected,
>B12 deficiency can damage the liver (over and above the other known
>damages). Failure to eat mindfully is seen as a major cause: that is -
>eating while busy, nervous, distracted (TV, reading, etc.),
>overeating, eating wrong foods, and so on. Sesame seeds and
>pomegranates support the deficient agni or digestive fire, and are
>recommended. Turmeric does not directly address the problem, but it is
>known to promote proper bacterial culture in the digestive system, so
>it may help some.

Great tips!

>A recent article (1994) in the journal "Plants and Soil"  claims that
>vegetables grown 'naturally' contain B-12. One nutritionist, citing
>this article, now claims that one can get B-12 from the vegan diet.
>Other nutritionists have not joined in that opinion, and continue to
>recommend supplements.

I would love to read this article. If you have it could you post on the
list?

Pat said:
>So the next question becomes, WHAT problems? How does one know what
>to look for in this exploration, or is the damage "silent"? How does
>one get 1000-1500mg (M/F) calcium by food, not filled-pills, without
>dairy? Molasses?(that's a lot of otherwise empty calories). Dandelion
>tea? (Spring and summer only) Collards? (Fall. But every day?) Dulse?
>Kelp? Laver? I gag, it takes a great deal to achieve those
>mg's..Sardines? My point is, that to acheive these Ca++ requirements
>narrows the selection of food calories considerably, and the spice of
>life variety with it.

>From the "Paleolithic Prescription" page 81: " At present there is
considerable controversy among nutritionists and physicians about the
proper amount of calcium recommended for daily human consumption.  An
analysis of over one hundred plant foods used by recent hunters and
gatherers support the notion that high levels of calcium intake are
desirable.  Wild vegetable foods average about 130 mg calcium per 100 g
portion; since Late Paleolithic people were eating about 1,460 g of
such food each day, plant foods would have provided over 1,800 mg of
calcium while the mat they ate would have given another 100 mg.
Chewing bones from fowl or small mammals might have substantially
increased this last value.
Even if plant foods made up only 30 percent of their estimated daily
diet, calcium levels would still be high by American standards.  The
more typical Paleolithic calcium intake of about 1,900 mg per day would
bring us closer to ( though still below) what is known about calcium
requirements in other mammalian species. Lower requirements estimates
(figures as low as 400 g per day have been suggested by some
nutritionists are far below the proportional estimates for other
mammals. "

So here is your answer Pat. You need to eat 1 1/2 lb. of wild
vegetables a day. ;-)

Bernarr said:
>Eat once daily, immediately before going to sleep.

Why would you want to eat all your food at one meal just before you go
to sleep when your digestive fires are at their lowest and your body
needs to rest? It defies all logic.

>Try to stand every moment, while awake.

Legs are for walking/running rather than for extended periods of
standing. When not in movement my favorite position is horizontal. :-)

>When having sex, practice injaculation, i.e. orgasms without
>enervating ejaculations!  No masturbation.

I believe this very un-natural technique puts an undue stress on the
urinary system by its re-directing of the seminal fluids into areas
they were never intended. I find moderate masturbation 3-4 times a day
an excellent way of maintaining glandular health. ;-)

>Am considered the "best laying on of hands" healer  in the world.
>...expert of all religious denominations. Am a guru!

Bernarr, in all your modesty :-) welcome to raw-food.

Kate, welcome to the list.  As an ex-vegan who no longer believes that
a diet that excludes animal foods is optimal, I cannot be of much help
to your husband.  However, I would suggest making some raw breakfast
meals for him. Soaking raw buckwheat groats or steel cut oats over
night in the fridge and throwing them in the blender with some soaked
almonds and some fresh fruits in the morning will provide him with a
couple of delicious breakfast alternatives.

Axel said:
>ten days ago, i came back from finishing the hoffman quadrinity
>process.it was the most profound, beautiful, intense and humane
>experience of my life.

I as well would very much like to hear some more of your experience
with HFQ.

Best, Peter
[log in to unmask]