Hi Tom,

<< I think that Internet is having a real impact on the raw community, and
this list (raw-food) seems to be the most influential. Because

I have not been in the "raw community" but have been doing my thing, all by my
self, for many years here in Maryland.  I cannot even begin to tell you what
it has been like for me, a practicing nutritionist basically figuring it out
for myself here, to have suddenly discovered that there is, in fact, a
community of people who think similarly to me. When we first got onto the
internet (aol) I searched using the word "fast" and "fasting" and got some
very weird and/or money-oriented or just stupid and discouraging websites.

When I finally discovered ANHS I was OVERWHELMED.  My family thought I had
lost my marbles, since for several weeks I was crying with delight and
astonishment and a feeling of instant communion with this entire community of
people like me who had books, organization, meetings, a history, MD's, and so
on.

And then I discovered the vegan, and then the "raw" communities, all on the
internet.  This list has changed my entire life, and therefoire the lives of
many people that I have contact with. My thinking has been broadened and
stimulated in so many ways.

<< The "party line" is being challenged, and people are more willing to try
different approaches. >>

It has been very useful to me to know whast the "party line" is, and to see
and understand what the challenges are,  and where they come from.  All this
foolishness and politics is actually helpful, since it has helped me to
understand what biases and "axes to grind" come to bear on supposedly
objective research.

I must say, though, that after reading these posts of the last two days, I
wish that some of you veterans could have been around in the last few months
of my experience on another couple of lists, where I have felt a little
isolated and kind of running out of patience.  There sure do seem to be a lot
of "flakes" around, and a lot of people who seem to use the unaccountability
of the internet to posture as authorities on any subject and give a lot of
advice.  It took me a little while to figure this out.

<<Of course the extremists are still around, and >>

This seems to be true, from what I have run across on other lists.  But these
people, or groups, appear foolish and I am sure will not have any big effect
on a raw-food "movement" in any long-term way. Most people are smart and
sensible enough to recognize greed and simple-minded theories.


Kirt,
<<  yet I am mostly struck by how certain folks will cling to the extremists,
defend them, etc. in the face of _any_information. .>>

Its not many people, I don't think.  I am assuming that lots of  sensible
people are just reading a lot of the foolishness, dismissing it, and going on
with their eating and their more sensible lives.  I'm thinking the extremists
are the most vocal on the internet.  Most people that I know can't be bothered
with all this reading and writing and sitting in front of a computer, anyway.

<< Blatent plagerism, pedophilia, lying, bullying--sometimes it seems the only
thing left unreported is raw skinheads and/or raw mass murderers. >>

LOL!!  I think they're mostly too timid.  I once made the mistake of writing
about body-builders that I work with, and got reamed.  There was also a flurry
of arrogant, self-righteous messages about the stupidity and wrong-mindedness
of anyone who lifted weights.  Evidently there is some ethic that says you're
supposed to be pretty skinny, or gaunt, or maybe its the same old class
elitist thing of "brains over brawn."  At any rate, the ones with the big
voices on the internet may be very bold online, but are cowards if it came to
anything real.

<< It really appears that reason will not defeat unreason, especially in the
arena of fringe diets. >>

Some people are desperate to have a simple solution.  So what?  Don't even pay
attention, once you see that's what they are lookiing for..  I delete those
messages without reading them - I don't have enough time to bother with that.
I wouldn't let foolishness like that bother me.  There are too many people who
have valuable contributions, or who are asking honest and intelligent
questions, that could benefit from your attention!  Anyway, that's my
attitude.

Anyway, Kirt, if its any comfort, you and your posts have been extremely
helpful and informative and emotionally supportive of me and what I try to do
in helping other people.

Tom,
<< the SF-LiFE Expo last year gave me reason for hope. >>

Well this sounds like something it might be worth coming across the country
for.  When is this? It would be greast to meet you all, in any case.

<< certain extremists are working hard to make that the basis of a cult. >>

Yes - there does seem to be the elements of a cult wanting to happen. It might
discredit any voice of common-sense that a raw "movement" might have.  I am
new to the movement, so I don't know enough to know what is at stake, or how
much of a real setback this would be.  Is it something to worry about? Or is
the raw "movement" so fringe at this point that this really wouldn't make any
difference anyway? Or is the raw movement actually getting some wider
exposure, and the trust and good thinking of the general public? I don't know
enough about the "politics" to understand the ramifications of this.

Anyway - thanks to you all out there who think and eat sensibly!

Lots of Love, Liza May ([log in to unmask]).