>> Pardon my ignorance, but how is Mortimer Adler?
>I haven't heard how he is doing.  I think he is still alive.  He is in
>his nineties.


You can't understand how often I do that(almost did it again).  I meant WHO
is Mortimer Adler and not how(almost did it again).  I think I have
something wrong with me.

>> I just love this stuff, really do.  It is so amazing when people forget
>> that, for millions of years, humans existed WITHOUT goverment.
>You mean before the advent of clans and farming, way back before
>civilization.  Why do you say they forget that?  Why do you thinnk it
>is important to remember that people who were uncivilized lived like
>wild animals?

This is assuming that we are currently civilized.  If anything, wild animals
are much more humane then we are.

>> And I won't even talk about those who mistakenly believes that human
>> beings can live together peacefully and harmoniously WITH
>> government.
>Well why don't you talk about them?

Are you one of those people? I hope not.

Anyways, history is my evidence, that's it.  Governments are those who
declare WAR on others.  Can't get any more anti-peace then that.

Government make laws and impose them on people who never *agreed* to those
laws and punish those who dare to act like a free person.  Can't get any
more anti-harmonious then that.

>> >I don't care what you think about Adler.  I agree with his definition.
>> >Many people do.  I will always be trying to instantiate government
>> >where government belongs, and you will always be trying to knock it
>> >down.  We won't live together peacefully and harmoniously; I'll say
>> >it's because we need government here or there, and you'll say it is
>> >because we don't.  I won't give in and neither will you.  Hence
>> >Adler's definition holds.
>>
>> Hey, Noam is one of those guys who doesn't know if government should be
>> allowed to exist in society, but then again, he does believe that the
>> people(who would be governed) should decide that, not him or anyone
>> else.
>
>No, I think you are wrong.  He recognizes a need for government.  He
>says its existence should be justified.

He says that he is "not sure" if the society needs government.  Also, he
believes any authority(even those that are temporary, but government is
forever) needs to be justified.

Milutin

--
Weapons not food, not homes, not shoes
Not need, just feed the war cannibal animal