Dan wrote:
>
> Bruce, you must be breathing some mighty rare air up there if this is a
> wake-up call.

No doubt about it. There is probably more competence per capita in Maine
than anywhere else in the nation. And, oddly, there is still a majority of
the working population who believe in the ethic of giving value for money.

But, I'm willing to admit that Grace's remark got me hot under the collar
and I didn't respond with as reasoned a comment as I, maybe, ought have.

So, I'll try again.

While I stand by my belief that the hiring agent has to take responsibility
for his or her choice of tradesperson, and I have to agree with Ken that
the term "tradesperson" should only be applied to just the sort of
practitioner who doesn't need constant watching, what I mostly object to is
the dynamic between the professions and the trades in the preservation
community that results in the lack of mutually beneficial communication
between the two parties, and, often, in an adversarial relationship which
jaundices the view of the professional and fosters a don't-give-a-shit
attitude among tradespeople.

While my experience is limited to Maine, I have to report that when, some
years ago, I made an attempt to try to get the State's educational
authorities to broaden their definition of vocational training worthy of
State support to include preservation trades, I found other tradespeople
willing to work with me, but received no support from any of the other
members of the preservation community. Which adds an element of irony when
I hear local professionals complaining about the quality of employee their
contractors and subs bring on the job.

I also find it quite frequently the case that when experienced tradespeople
offer the benefit of their knowledge to professional clients they are
treated with condescension and rudeness, even when the responsible agent
has just entered the profession after academic preparation and has no
hands-on experience available to make a judgment about the aptness of the
tradesperson's contribution. That doesn't do much for the tradesperson's
attitude or enthusiasm.  That's not to say that inevitably the professional
should defer to the tradesperson, but, maybe, more tact and willingness to
listen could be employed.

> In the land of production construction, this is a very real
> issue.  It flows from tradesfolks that mostly just don't care; only some
> don't know any better.  I saw this particularly in the finishing trades
> when I was doing construction supervision.  Folks would just trample the
> **** out of anything in their way, whatever was necessary to get in and
out
> quickly.

Again, I often find problems like this to be the result of a lack of
communication. If enough employers communicate what they expect from their
contractors and subs, then standards of behavior will be established. I
know that it is part of the human condition to stew and fume rather than
confront until confrontation becomes inevitable, but the stewer has to take
some responsibility for this.

> I have great sympathy for the constractor that wants to do quality work,
> but cannot find decent labor with which to do it.  Down hereabouts in
> boomtown the unemployment rate is 1.9%.  There are not enough proper
> tradespeople available from which the hiring agency or client can choose
--
> if they chose to do so.  But as we have opined and moaned before, many
> don't even care to or know to choose good tradespeople.  Yet, there are
> enough hiring agencies and clients who do care that the really well
> qualified tradesfolks I know have the luxury of choosing their
work...there
> is more to do than they can do, so they can choose the really good
projects
> that have enlightened clients with enough time available to wait the
10-12
> months until the craftsperson can get to the job.  Good for them, but
what
> about the rest of the historic resources that are going wanting for lack
of
> enlightened clients and trades?

This gets us back to the issue of education, doesn't it. Mention was made
in another post of European expectations for quality, and the ability of
tradespeople to satisfy those expectations. Would you like to compare the
preparation available for the trades there and here, and the acceptance
there of skilled tradespeople as members of society, versus the distinction
made here between the college educated and everyone else?

And, shall we talk about pay levels and what type of person is likely to
accept the starting pay to enter the trades as an employee?
>
> They could grow and do more volume, but they can't hire anybody to work
> with them, even to train them...most won't stick around for that long.
So
> they choose to remain one person shops, or three person teams, and work
> quality not volume.  I really admire a business that can do quality AND
> volume.

I'll go back to the above. If they can't hire and keep conscientious
employees it is, in part, because the system of values is skewed against
honoring or financially rewarding such employees. America has made its
choices. Here in Maine any kid who has taken HS auto shop can find a
starting job in a service dept. for $12.00 or $14.00 per hour, with
benefits, while entry level jobs on preservation crews are benefitless and
likely to pay $5.00 less.
As to Dan's personal experiences with Earl the Butcher et al, I certainly
feel for him, but I can't help but remember that among the reasons I got
out of preservation contracting was the difficulty I had in finding clients
who were able to understand and accept that it was a necessary protocol to
spend money first on assuring the structural integrity of their house
before putting it into cosmetic details; or find clients who thought that
it was valuable or useful to pay me for my time spent investigating their
structure, researching the details of its probable original  condition or
documenting my work.

It is, as has often been said, a two-way street.

Bruce

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