I agree with Ilene. But if you've got moisture migration from the
interior, paint failure may be the least of your problems. Once again,
the rule seem to be "follow the water".
I'd add that once you've achieved the dry wood, quality prep and paint,
the paint should wear, rather than outright fail. In six to ten years
you will have paint fading, getting dirty and wearing away. At that
stage, the prep is minimal and a single coat of paint may do the job.
If we are talking about historic materials with lots of paint buildup,
that may be a different situation. Are we talking about that?
-jc
On Thursday, October 9, 2003, at 08:34 AM, Ilene R. Tyler wrote:
> I important thing is to keep/get the moisture out of the wood, hence
> the
> reason to avoid powerwashing. Backpriming/edgepriming new or
> reinstalled/salvaged siding also helps. Being a dry climate, moisture
> migration from the interior is absorbed into the wood where is no vapor
> barrier. So, all that means that no amount of surface prep/scraping
> will extend the paint coating life, if moisture is getting from the
> back, or if the exterior surface is damp when the paint goes on. If
> you
> can dry it out and keep it dry and paint all surfaces with good
> (preferred oil base) primer and two acrylic finish coats, paint should
> last 6-10 years. Good luck!
>
>
> QUINN EVANS | ARCHITECTS
>
> Ilene R. Tyler, FAIA
>
> 219 1/2 N. Main Street
> Ann Arbor, MI 48104
> [log in to unmask]
> www.quinnevans.com
> v 734.663.5888
> f 734.663.5044
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Automatic digest processor
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>
> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 4:01 AM
> To: Recipients of BULLAMANKA-PINHEADS digests
> Subject: BULLAMANKA-PINHEADS Digest - 8 Oct 2003 to 9 Oct 2003
> (#2003-265)
>
>
> There are 3 messages totalling 317 lines in this issue.
>
> Topics of the day:
>
> 1. Been meaning to put together a web site?
> 2. FW: Paint is paint is paint, maybe. (2)
>
> --
> To terminate puerile preservation prattling among pals and the
> uncoffee-ed, or to change your settings, go to:
> <http://maelstrom.stjohns.edu/archives/bullamanka-pinheads.html>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 09:29:41 -0400
> From: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Been meaning to put together a web site?
>
> <<As long as your site is heavy on content, and light on
> sex/crime/death/disaster, it is now possible to cover your expenses,
> and
> more, just through placing a few unobtrusive text ads.>>
>
> With 13 million hits, they are getting an advertising bargain.
>
> Larry, seems to me this should have happened a lot sooner, since your
> website ROCKS. Anyone not taking advantage of the quality would be (as
> Mr. T would say) a fool.
>
> -Heidi
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 22:04:49 -0400
> From: "Becker, Dan" <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: FW: Paint is paint is paint, maybe.
>
> Calling all extreme northern pinhead brethren in from the cold...CP in
> =
> BC, Callan, Leeke. Maybe Irene, I dunno...she might still be too close
> =
> to the Mason-Dixon line.
>
> John L., and maybe John C., will recall my spouting off in a paint =
> thread over there in Forum-L a couple of months ago. This email to me =
> just showed up. What can you guys say about paint films in extreme =
> climes? We weren't talking about extreme climes on Forum-L. John L. and
> = I posited that preparation is critical for success; without good prep
> no = matter the quality of the paint, it isn't going to last. Is there
> a
> = point at which no matter the quality of the prep, a quality mass
> market = paint product isn't going to last? Mike E? For extremes, do
> we
> have to = specify something more suited to extremes? Is it literally
> the
> cold = leading to brittleness or the movement of the substrate due to =
> contraction and later expansion that leads to failure? Is it the lack
> of
> = elasticity in the film, or something more insidious?
>
> I have his permission to solicit all y'all's assembled wisdom on this.
> I
> = don't understand why you can't get paint to stick in a town of 600 =
> buildings in Idaho. I'll report back to him whatall you think.
>
> dan cover the world below the 50th parallel becker
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Larry Hoppe [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Tue 10/7/2003 5:45 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Cc: Ann Swanson
> Subject: Paint is paint is paint, maybe.
> =20
> I read with interest your assessment on painting historic siding. Does
> = your data reflect information on our issue in far northern? Idaho, =
> namely, low humidity and extreme cold in winter; and snow 4' to 6' deep
> = standing most of the normal winter. =20 =20 The paint here doesn't
> seem to last more than a few seasons ( Five years = is typical)
> regardless of quality from what I've been advised by = citizens who
> have
> lived here much longer than I.=20 =20 Are there any internet resources
> you can recommend that our Historic = Preservation Commission might use
> to add to our self-help education = efforts. =20 =20 For background,
> the
> entire City of Wallace, Idaho (approximately 600 =
> structures) is on the National Register of Historic Places. Thanks for
> = any info you can provide. =20 Larry Hoppe Chairman,=20 Planning
> Zoning, And=20
> Historic Preservation Commission =20
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 22:40:02 -0500
> From: John Callan <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: FW: Paint is paint is paint, maybe.
>
> --Apple-Mail-12--683226716
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset=US-ASCII;
> format=flowed
>
> At first when you were writing about extreme climates, I thought we
> were
> talking Artic Circle. Idaho shouldn't differ much from anywhere else
> in
> the northern tier of states, or the southern tier of provinces.
> Most of the "mass market" paint failure I've seen is caused by the
> use
> of powerwashers. And most of what I've seen has been right here in my
> neighborhood. There's a real prejudice in favor of new fangled labor
> saving gadgets, materals and methods. But they don't last worth a dam.
> I find that if you scrape and sand and use a good primer and two
> coats, paint is paint and it lasts a good long time. It wears out
> faster when it gets a lot of abrasion...sand and ice, wind and rain.
> But
> you really have to scrape and prime. The good news is that vynl siding
> doesn't seem to last much longer than good paint.
>
> Them damned power-washers, I've got neighbors painting their houses
> every three years! You'd think the black stuff growing on their siding
> might be a clue. But they think I'm a lunatic 'cause I'm out there
> scraping. Well I may be a lunatic, but the areas I've finished
> painting
> have stayed painted.
>
> -jc
>
> On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 09:04 PM, Becker, Dan wrote:
>
>> Calling all extreme northern pinhead brethren in from the cold...CP in
>
>> BC, Callan, Leeke. Maybe Irene, I dunno...she might still be too close
>
>> to the Mason-Dixon line.
>>
>> John L., and maybe John C., will recall my spouting off in a paint
>> thread over there in Forum-L a couple of months ago. This email to me
>> just showed up. What can you guys say about paint films in extreme
>> climes? We weren't talking about extreme climes on Forum-L. John L.
>> and I posited that preparation is critical for success; without good
>> prep no matter the quality of the paint, it isn't going to last. Is
>> there a point at which no matter the quality of the prep, a quality
>> mass market paint product isn't going to last? Mike E? For extremes,
>> do we have to specify something more suited to extremes? Is it
>> literally the cold leading to brittleness or the movement of the
>> substrate due to contraction and later expansion that leads to
>> failure? Is it the lack of elasticity in the film, or something more
>> insidious?
>>
>> I have his permission to solicit all y'all's assembled wisdom on this.
>
>> I don't understand why you can't get paint to stick in a town of 600
>> buildings in Idaho. I'll report back to him whatall you think.
>>
>> dan cover the world below the 50th parallel becker
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Larry Hoppe [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>> Sent: Tue 10/7/2003 5:45 PM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Cc: Ann Swanson
>> Subject: Paint is paint is paint, maybe.
>>
>> I read with interest your assessment on painting historic siding. Does
>
>> your data reflect information on our issue in far northern? Idaho,
>> namely, low humidity and extreme cold in winter; and snow 4' to 6'
>> deep standing most of the normal winter.
>>
>> The paint here doesn't seem to last more than a few seasons ( Five
>> years is typical) regardless of quality from what I've been advised by
>
>> citizens who have lived here much longer than I.
>>
>> Are there any internet resources you can recommend that our Historic
>> Preservation Commission might use to add to our self-help education
>> efforts.
>>
>> For background, the entire City of Wallace, Idaho (approximately 600
>> structures) is on the National Register of Historic Places. Thanks
>> for any info you can provide.
>>
>> Larry Hoppe
>> Chairman,
>> Planning Zoning, And
>> Historic Preservation Commission
>>
>> --
>> To terminate puerile preservation prattling among pals and the
>> uncoffee-ed, or to change your settings, go to:
>> <http://maelstrom.stjohns.edu/archives/bullamanka-pinheads.html>
>>
>>
> John Callan, Architect, Inc.
> Historic Preservation and Museum Services
> 784 Deerwood Circle
> Lino Lakes, Minnesota 55014-5433
>
> (651) 486-0890
> [log in to unmask]
>
> --Apple-Mail-12--683226716
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Content-Type: text/enriched;
> charset=US-ASCII
>
> At first when you were writing about extreme climates, I thought we
> were
> talking Artic Circle. Idaho shouldn't differ much from anywhere else
> in
> the northern tier of states, or the southern tier of provinces. Most
> of
> the "mass market" paint failure I've seen is caused by the use of
> powerwashers. And most of what I've seen has been right here in my
> neighborhood. There's a real prejudice in favor of new fangled labor
> saving gadgets, materals and methods. But they don't last worth a dam.
> I find that if you scrape and sand and use a good primer and two coats,
> paint is paint and it lasts a good long time. It wears out faster when
> it gets a lot of abrasion...sand and ice, wind and rain. But you
> really
> have to scrape and prime. The good news is that vynl siding doesn't
> seem to last much longer than good paint.
>
>
> Them damned power-washers, I've got neighbors painting their houses
> every three years! You'd think the black stuff growing on their siding
> might be a clue. But they think I'm a lunatic 'cause I'm out there
> scraping. Well I may be a lunatic, but the areas I've finished
> painting
> have stayed painted.
>
>
> -jc
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 09:04 PM, Becker, Dan wrote:
>
>
> <excerpt>Calling all extreme northern pinhead brethren in from the
> cold...CP in BC, Callan, Leeke. Maybe Irene, I dunno...she might still
> be too close to the Mason-Dixon line.
>
>
> John L., and maybe John C., will recall my spouting off in a paint
> thread over there in Forum-L a couple of months ago. This email to me
> just showed up. What can you guys say about paint films in extreme
> climes? We weren't talking about extreme climes on Forum-L. John L. and
> I posited that preparation is critical for success; without good prep
> no
> matter the quality of the paint, it isn't going to last. Is there a
> point at which no matter the quality of the prep, a quality mass market
> paint product isn't going to last? Mike E? For extremes, do we have to
> specify something more suited to extremes? Is it literally the cold
> leading to brittleness or the movement of the substrate due to
> contraction and later expansion that leads to failure? Is it the lack
> of
> elasticity in the film, or something more insidious?
>
>
> I have his permission to solicit all y'all's assembled wisdom on this.
> I
> don't understand why you can't get paint to stick in a town of 600
> buildings in Idaho. I'll report back to him whatall you think.
>
>
> dan cover the world below the 50th parallel becker
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: Larry Hoppe [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
>
> Sent: Tue 10/7/2003 5:45 PM
>
> To: [log in to unmask]
>
> Cc: Ann Swanson
>
> Subject: Paint is paint is paint, maybe.
>
>
> I read with interest your assessment on painting historic siding. Does
> your data reflect information on our issue in far northern? Idaho,
> namely, low humidity and extreme cold in winter; and snow 4' to 6' deep
> standing most of the normal winter.
>
>
> The paint here doesn't seem to last more than a few seasons ( Five
> years
> is typical) regardless of quality from what I've been advised by
> citizens who have lived here much longer than I.
>
>
> Are there any internet resources you can recommend that our Historic
> Preservation Commission might use to add to our self-help education
> efforts.
>
>
> For background, the entire City of Wallace, Idaho (approximately 600
> structures) is on the National Register of Historic Places. Thanks for
> any info you can provide.
>
>
> Larry Hoppe
>
> Chairman,
>
> Planning Zoning, And
>
> Historic Preservation Commission
>
>
> --
>
> To terminate puerile preservation prattling among pals and the
>
> uncoffee-ed, or to change your settings, go to:
>
> <<http://maelstrom.stjohns.edu/archives/bullamanka-pinheads.html>
>
>
>
> </excerpt><fontfamily><param>Gadget</param>John Callan, Architect, Inc.
>
> Historic Preservation and Museum
> Services</fontfamily><fontfamily><param>Helvetica</param><bigger>
>
> </bigger></fontfamily>784 Deerwood Circle
>
> Lino Lakes, Minnesota 55014-5433
>
>
> (651) 486-0890
>
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> --Apple-Mail-12--683226716--
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of BULLAMANKA-PINHEADS Digest - 8 Oct 2003 to 9 Oct 2003
> (#2003-265)
> ***********************************************************************
> *
>
> --
> To terminate puerile preservation prattling among pals and the
> uncoffee-ed, or to change your settings, go to:
> <http://maelstrom.stjohns.edu/archives/bullamanka-pinheads.html>
>
>
John Callan, Architect, Inc.
Historic Preservation and Museum Services
784 Deerwood Circle
Lino Lakes, Minnesota 55014-5433
(651) 486-0890
[log in to unmask]
|
