Thanks Barbara, Ben, and Liza for the milk stuff. Plenty of info to play
around with.

Barbara:
>The yoghurt should
>be ready in about six hours.

Wow, that's quick. I probably didn't use enough starter (only a heaping
tablespoon in a quart). It was pretty thin except towards the bottom, but
at least it didn't curdle.

Liza:
>drinkable (and this form tasted a little more sour, as I remember it)
>and some people (me, a great lover of fat) liked it super thick, about
>the consistency and texture of sour cream.

So what happens to the milkfat when yogurt or kefer is made? The only whole
milk yogurt we see around here is Brown Cow "Cream at the Top". Does the
cream naturally rise or do these folks maybe add it afterwards?

>Same thing for buttermilk. If
>I'm remembering right, the yogurt took a while - 3 days to a week I
>think. The buttermilk was quicker - a couple of days.

So you just drink the buttermilk straight or what? I don't think I have
ever even tasted buttermilk.

>The next morning there would be the most
>yummiest creamiest cheese in the diaper. A lot of milk makes not a lot
>of cheese in this way, so your two gallons will go quick.

I think that's what we have in the fridge right now but we're drawing
straws to see who is gonna be the first to taste it (where's Mikey when you
need him?;))

>By the way - my favorite raw goat's milk dairy farmer will ship you
>awesome goat's yogurt - just awesome - soooooo creamy and yummy I

OK. Lay the contact info on me once again. Or send me to the archives if
you prefer ;)

>And we have six frames of
>honey just harvested, which everybody but me is gobbling like liquid
>gold - to me it smells awful and looks nauseating.

Time to dig _under_ the excluder and find some brood ;)

>To me this whole
>process has been very interesting, because before this instincto
>"experiment" I would have just planned my meals from my head, not my
>real appetite, and not paid much attention to these messages that my
>body really does not want certain foods, and craves others.

Yeah, the good old days are probably over for you. Nothing like a new food
your body really craves is there? Part of the whole instincto thing may
just be increasing the range of foods eaten. Perhaps the new foods, like
raw mackeral or marrow, remediated some sort of deficiency and one things
are more balanced they loose their superfood status. Cherry tomatoes will
not let you eat them if you don't need them. Its surprising isn't it?

That the goat yogurt won't stop for you is interesting. If it _never_ stops
it might lend support to the instincto idea that dairy can't be "evaluated
by sensory instinct". Or it may simple be a food that makes a lovely staple
for you, one you can grow old with.

Do you ever worry about the calcium/magnesium ratio of dairy being outta
kilter. Silly or not, Melisa pops some magnesium with any serving of dairy.
Loren Cordain's posts on the Paleo Symposium list all referred to cow's
milk. Don't know what the ratio is like for goat milk. Basically, he
figures the paleo calcium/mag ratio was 1:1 overall. Whereas it is way
heavy calcium in cow's milk. I don't know.

****

I think what may happen for some long term instinctos is that as they get
more balance nutritionally more and more food that is really tasty is
harder to find and what was thrilling in a sensory way for the first months
or years becomes more ordinary. Further, we may not be completely adapted
to an all raw diet after all these generations cooking, so the instincto
purist may end up with some new imbalances in the longterm. Who knows? But,
methinks, the simple premise of being respectful to the taste of a simple
unprepared food is a fine addition to anyone's how-do-I-feed-myself bag of
tricks.

Cheers,
Kirt

Secola  /\  Nieft
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