Bo7b:

>What's your definition of "leftist-oriented"?  From each according to his
>ability, to each according to his need?  Communal ownership of means of
>production?  Altruism?  Egalitarianism?

I don't want to go into complicated definitions, but at least I consider
that society should do its best, so that as many people as possible have
access to decent conditions. And, for me, "decent" includes health. And
health includes raw food.

Surrealistic dialogue:
A: I have got arthritis.
B: I know the perfect solution for you: eat instinctively!
A: OK. Is it more expensive than eating boiled potatoes?
B: It can be. How much do you earn?
A: 800$/month. I am married, and I have 2 children.
B: So, you won't be able to afford Orkos food. Maybe you could grow things
in your garden?
A: I have no garden. Do you think it is worth moving?
B: Yes, definitely. You will soon see the results.
A: What foods do you prefer?
B: Durians, sapodillas, mango Konkouri, Thai coconut juice.
A: How can I grow these in my garden?
B: You cannot. You will have to eat fruits and vegetables from your own
country.
A: Can instincto succeed without exotic fruits?
B: It is very difficult to be satisfied without exotic fruits.
A: @#$%!

>Do you believe their "need" creates an obligation on Orkos to provide them
>food?

Anyway, if you allow people to work 50 hr/week for a low salary, why not
allow that in factories? It is illegal, that's all.

Stefan:
>I guess you mean the "financial stop".

Yes, sorry.

>What you would like, sounds like a communist's approach. Everyone,
>be he rich or not, must be able to afford x (whatever x is).

No. For me, x includes the minimum (i.e., the possibility to eat raw food).

>I know of instinctos in my city who still think they must have a car
>(totally superfluous in this city with its dense public traffic
>system). On the other hand they are complaining, that their money
>doesn't suffice to buy expensive food from Orkos (or organic food).

I was not talking about those persons. Personally, I don't have a car,
and I couldn't afford 100% Orkos food. My salary would just be enough
to pay for (a small) apartment+clothing+80% organic+20% Orkos. But I
know some persons who have a far worse situation (see my "dialogue" above),
and I would like them to be *able*, if they *wanted*, to have a healthful
(and 100% raw) diet.

You cannot compare your situation to persons who earn the minimum salary,
waste 3 hours/day in public transportation, come back home exhausted,
have to care for children, etc.

>There it is - this sort of whining again. I've heard these arguments
>hundred of times. People are always whining, that their environment
>prevented them from getting a good job, that their parents didn't send
>them to the best school and so on until infinity.

I was just trying to imagine what it looks like to be in the lower class.
Example: until the age of 17, I always did well at school, without (or
with minimal) homework. And when I was 12, one of my classmates worked
A LOT on his homework, had 2 brothers and 1 sisters, and all the family
lived in a 24 m^2 apartment. And he didn't succeed at school.

>I tell you, what my alternatives are. If my employer fires me today,
>you will see me tomorrow walking to all supermarkets and warehouses
>asking if they need someone to work as a cashier or in the store.
>I know I will find such a job and I will earn enough money to live on
>a low level until I again have a profession that fits my qualification.

I was talking about public garbage, and you talk about being a cashier...
Yes, I think I could be a cashier. But would you manipulate heavy garbage
bins, in the rain, in cold weather, at 6 a.m.? Not very good for your
health... and not enough to afford Orkos food.

>Instinctive free and liberal wishes,

When you have to deal with "financial stops", you are not exactly free
(IMO).

Jean-Louis ([log in to unmask])