Getting that kind of data out of those companies would be about like getting
the truth out of Donald Trump!

Tom Fowle WA6IVG

On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 09:54:55AM -0800, Jim Gammon wrote:
> Jim, I used to hear figures from the Nfb and/or AFB that some 10 
> to 15 percent of the blind population used braille and that was 
> measured from the working age blind, which would reduce your 
> population even more.  It would be interesting to collect data 
> from all the companies who sell braille equipped notetakers, and 
> braille displays to see just how many are in use and then again 
> how to find out how many of those are really being used by the 
> people who have them.  Jim WA6EKS
> 
>  ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jim Shaffer <[log in to unmask]
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Date sent: Thu, 12 Nov 2015 05:49:25 -0600
> Subject: Re: Accessibility of APRS?
> 
> Another part of the problem is that one accommodation doesn't 
> work for all
> folks.  I much prefer operating my station, which now includes a 
> Flex radio
> by the way, using a 40 cell braille display.  When I'm using the 
> radio, I
> turn my computer's speech off.  But look at all the blind folks 
> who either
> don't know braille, or don't use it.
> 
> And then there's the problem of market share.  I've heard the 
> claim that 15%
> of the population has some disability.  But does that represent 
> 15% of the
> market?  That's what businesses really need to look at.  As we 
> all know, the
> disabled are also economically disadvantaged.  Also, when I 
> encounter
> figures like the one I've cited, I wonder what demographics they 
> represent.
> Is, for example, a large percentage of that 15% over 70 years 
> old?
> 
> So in addition to having divergent accessibility needs, we have a 
> diminished
> market share.
> --
> Jim, KE5AL
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eric Oyen
> Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2015 1:06 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Accessibility of APRS?
> 
> like I said elsewhere, it seems counter intuitive.  However, once 
> a =
> population of a specific disability type reaches a certain number 
> =
> (critical mass), manufacturers start to get forced to pay 
> attention.
> 
> There are exceptions (such as apple).
> 
> Still, about the only way that we are going to get paid any 
> attention is =
> if we can demonstrate numbers.
> 
> One other thing, It seems that products specifically marketed to 
> the =
> blind tend to be anywhere from 3x to 12x more expensive, even 
> though the =
> cost to make said products is the same (or less) than 
> conventional =
> products.  This also needs to be changed.  If accessibility were 
> designed =
> in from minute one and marketed to every one, there would be no 
> market =
> disparity that currently exists now.
> 
> Take for example the SDR radios out there.  In nearly all cases, 
> you a =
> computer.  THere are a lot of hams that would USE an SDR if they 
> didn't =
> have to worry about the computer.  Now comes HamPod.  It acts as 
> the =
> hardware interface that so many hams like.  no need for a 
> computer.  that =
> means WE can use it.  If I had about $1200, I would get an 
> Allicraft K3 =
> or KX3 and a HamPod.  At that point, I wouldn't need to use a 
> screen =
> reader machine for most operations.  At least, I wouldn't be the 
> only ham =
> that the HamPod would need to be marketed to.  Besides, its a 
> blind ham =
> developing the device.  :)
> 
> DE n7zzt Eric
> 
> On Nov 11, 2015, at 2:15 PM, Jim Shaffer wrote:
> 
>  Eric, getting all our blind friends to become hams wouldn't do 
> it =
> either.=20
>  For example, look at all the products that are not accessible, 
> for =
> example,=20
>  the Keurig 2.0 coffee brewers.  Are there even any accessible 
> new =
> Sirius/XM=20
>  radios?
>  --
>  Jim, ke5al
>  -----Original Message-----=20
>  From: Eric Oyen
>  Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2015 1:42 PM
>  To: [log in to unmask]
>  Subject: Re: Accessibility of APRS?
> =20
>  actually, there is a way.
>  method 1: use a concurrent table that contains columns for 
> station ID, =
> =3D
>  LAT, LONG, DIrection of travel, Velocity, etc.
> =20
>  method 2 might involve using an app like apple maps (on their 
> iPhone) =
> =3D
>  which can tell the location of a pointer on the map (used in 
> turn by =3D=
> 
>  turn navigation).
> =20
>  Honestly, I think the first method is easier to achieve.
> =20
>  The problem with map description is that it needs a lot of 
> information =
> =3D
>  not easily presentable and also needs a large amount of 
> bandwidth for =
> =3D
>  retrieval of location specifics in real time.
> =20
>  I have noticed this issue about a lot of the digital mode 
> software for =
> =3D
>  ham radio.  almost none of it is properly accessible for the 
> blind =3D
>  (especially dm88 in HRD).  getting anyone to acknowledge that we 
> (as a =
> =3D
>  community of hams) even exists is starting to become a full time 
> job =3D=
> 
>  (and sometimes even major frustration as I get the impression 
> that =
> they =3D
>  don't want to hear from us).
> =20
>  perhaps what we need to do is to find every blind person we can 
> and =3D
>  encourage them to become hams.  The larger our population in a 
> specific =
> =3D
>  population market, the more we get listened to.  Its simple, 
> direct and =
> =3D
>  easy to do.
> =20
>  DE n7zzt Eric
> =20
>  On Nov 11, 2015, at 12:05 PM, John Miller wrote:
> =20
>  I've experimented with APRS and I don't see a way, It shows 
> actual =3D
>  maps on=3D20
>  the screen with people pinpointed on them, nothing is described 
> that =
> I =3D
>  can=3D20
>  tell except maybe longitude and latitude and I'm not even 
> totally =
> sure =3D
>  about=3D20
>  that for sure.  I don't see it being able to be accessible in 
> it's =3D
>  current=3D20
>  state and not sure there's really any way they could make it =3D
>  accessible.
>  =3D20
>  -----Original Message-----=3D20
>  From: Matthew Chao
>  Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2015 1:08 PM
>  To: [log in to unmask]
>  Subject: Accessibility of APRS?
>  =3D20
>  Hi, Folks.  I have a Kenwood TMV710A which has APRS.  Is there 
> any
>  way to make APRS accessible?  Thanks.--Matt, N1IBB.=3D20=20
> =20
> =20
>  ---
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