Don't we all ask at one time or other when our family or friends call upon
us, "WHAT DO YOU WANT!" For the folks using screen readers the quoted text
was in all capitals indicating shouting. Which is the same thing as Why are
you disturbing me. Perhaps the reason for the question might also be
because, Saul was asking
Samuel to predict for him the future. For which request Saul was punished
greatly. Both in this life, and in that to come no doubt. We aren't to ask
the saints to either predict future events for us. Nor are we to ask them
to perform for us, like trained seals. Which was what Samuel was being
asked to do. If I were being asked such, I would be a little mifft too. If
I were asked to predict for someone something I would perhaps ask the same
thing. The unholy nature of what Saul did was made manifest in his request
of Samuel itself. The fact that he actually and faithfully believed Samuel
could be called upon at all is a testimony there can be interaction between
us and saints who no longer live on the earth. Usually when necromancy
occurs it consists of a selfish motive such as the one Saul expressed.
Which will surely be punished by God. This is also why witches, sooth
Sayers and such are forbidden. Because it is not meant for us to know the
winning power ball numbers.
The golf concerning Lazarus Abraham and divies existed only for those who do
not reside in heavenly realms. Proof of this being in the true, and certain
death of Jesus, and his friend Lazarus. Whom he raised from the dead
himself. Who was not in the same catagory as was
Divies. After being dead four days. Martha mentioning to Jesus
putrefaction had begun by the time he arrived. If this golf
of which was spoken existed between the saints neither Jesus nor his friend
Lazarus would be able to return to us here on earth. Such was also true
when elisha raised the Shunammite's Son, from the sleep of death. -----
Original Message -----
From: "Grant E. Metcalf" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2014 11:13 AM
Subject: Re: Praying to the dead
> Wasn't Samuel's complaint to Saul, "why are you disturbing me?" To me this
> is an indication that the dead saints are not preoccupied with those of us
> who are still here on earth. Yes, God allowed one incident which provided
> bad news to King Saul and scared the wits out of the demonicly controled
> witch. Once again I repeat, the witnesses of Hebrews 12:1 are the
> testimonies or lifestyle witness of Old Testament saints described in
> Hebrews chapter eleven and given for our benefit.
> Listening for His shout!
> Grant
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Angel
> Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2014 6:39 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Praying to the dead
>
> We aren't talking about necromancy here. Even if what you say is true,
> God
> allowed Saul to be visited by Samuel. When he was called up from the
> dead.
> Also, if it were true, there wouldn't be an exhortation and a condemnation
> for those who actively practice necromancy. There are those who claim the
> spirit of Samuel was demonic in origin. But, if one believes totally in
> sola scriptura, as protestants do, the bible doesn't make that clear.
> Thus
> believing in that leans on protestant interpretation and protestant
> tradition to sustain such belief. In any case, The passage to which you
> refer is that conversation between Abraham and divies. In which Divies
> was
> requesting father Abraham to do something even the saints who have
> preceded
> us can not do. Because the saints' job is not to evangelize after they
> have
> left this world. Nor is it to provide room service for those residing in
> hell. Also, the saints regardless where is their residence have no
> obligation to any who are in hell. Also, The story to which you refer was
> one told by Jesus before his great sacrifice for us. Which sacrifice
> transfigured us all forever. Evangelizing is our job alone. As was
> stated
> in the great commission to the apostles that they go in to the whole world
> and preach the gospel to every creature. On the mount of Transfiguration
> Moses and Elijah was seen on that mount talking together with Jesus.
> Which
> disproves what you say about saints not being mobile between the two
> worlds.
> In fact, Saint Peter was so moved he suggested a monument should be
> erected
> to memorialize the occurrence. Further, at least one conversation did
> occur
> between Divies and father Abraham. As do those between the saints and us,
> assisted by the holy spirit.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Karen Carter" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2014 1:17 AM
> Subject: Re: Praying to the dead
>
>
> Because there is a big void that seperates them from earth and hell. The
> ones in hell cannot for the sane reason. Only angels and evil spirits can
> come back and forth
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jul 26, 2014, at 1:05 AM, Angel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> That sort of puts a constraint on just what it is they can do doesn't it?
>> If the angels, who are constantly praising God, as are we here on earth
>> without ceasing, and are given time to constantly serve us as guardian
>> Angels, ministering to our needs. If we can be constantly praising God,
>> both waking and sleeping, while we have jobs and raise families here on
>> earth. Why can't the saints intercede for us in heaven, as we who live
>> here in this plane of existence find time to pray for those on this list
>> who ask for prayer? While still praising God. If we can find time in
>> this temporal world to pray for those who request it of us, then the
>> saints, who live in a timeless eternity surely can devote time, which
>> isn't even an issue for them any longer to pray for us. Especially so,
>> because physical constraints such as the needs presented by the physical
>> body are not issues for them. Constant praise to God in Heaven is
>> understood, and is assumed by us as a primary postulate by all the
>> heavenly host, both angels and saints.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Karen Carter" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2014 12:38 AM
>> Subject: Re: Praying to the dead
>>
>>
>> They can not intercede for you only Jesus can the saints are in Heaven
>> where you remember the earth know more because you are to busy praising
>> The Lord read Luke 16.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jul 25, 2014, at 8:57 PM, Angel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>>
>>> When the saints either living or dead intercede for us, we aren't
>>> praying to them. Just as I am not praying to you if I were to ask for
>>> your prayers for me. If I were wanting your assistance that I might
>>> endure a difficult time in my life. Also, as the second McCabe's isn't
>>> in your cannon, I won't even expect those scriptures to cancel out those
>>> which you quoted. As they would be dismissed. I will not engage in an
>>> argument regarding something without a possible satisfactory resolution
>>> for either of us. Prayers aren't offered up to our saints. In the same
>>> sense as I suspect was meant by your post. Rather the saints continue to
>>> exist conjoined with us as does Jesus, and the blessed Theotocos .
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Karen Carter" <[log in to unmask]>
>>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>> Sent: Friday, July 25, 2014 7:11 PM
>>> Subject: Praying to the dead
>>>
>>>
>>> A few verses for those who think you can pray to dead ones. Like saints
>>> or relatives. Isaiah 8:19-20. 19. When someone tells you to consult
>>> mediums and spiritists, who whisper and mutter, should not a people
>>> inquire of their God? Why consult the dead on behalf of the living.
>>> 20. Consult God's instruction and the testimony of warning. If anyone
>>> does not speak according to this word, they have no light of dawn.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone=
|
