Agree


-----Original Message-----
From: For blind ham radio operators [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
On Behalf Of Buddy Brannan
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Why I am not a member of Arrl

Hi,

In this case, I have to disagree with you, Brian.=20

They likely said that the reduced cost blind membership was not eligible =
for the free book. As a membership without QST is $8, far less than the =
cost of any book, I don't see tho as discriminatory at all. There's =
nothing preventing you from joining at the full $35 (I think that's =
right) rate, as a blind person. If you want that argument to hold water, =
you can use one of your ways to read the print QST, and pay for it just =
the same. That, IMO, is a completely different issue from this.=20
--
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY



On Mar 20, 2012, at 6:03 PM, brian <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Hi this Brian n8mnx and this does not surprise me at all that Arrl is 
> =
not=20
> interested in excessability.  Several years ago I RECEIVED ONE OF =
THOSE=20
> LETTERS ASKING ME TO JOIN AND THEY OFFERED A FREE BOOK OR IT MIGHT =
HAVE BEEN=20
> 2 AND THERE WERE 6 BOOKS TO CHOOSE FROM BUT THE LETTER STATED THAT 
> THE=20=

> OFFEREXCLUDED THE BLIND NOW HOW'S THAT FOR DISCRIMINATION DON'T THEY =
KNOW=20
> THAT BLIND HAVE WAYS TO READ PRINT? wE HAVE OCR SOFTWHEAR AND 
> READING=20=

> MACHINES AND THERE ARE SERVICES THAT WILL TAPE OR BRAILLE FOR A =
NOMINAL FEE.=20
> tHE POINT IT IS THAT THEY DID NOT THINK THAT WE BLIND COULD READ ONE =
OF=20
> THERE BOOKS WE ALWAYS FIND WAYS TO GAIN ACCESS TO PRINT ARRL CHOULD =
KNOW=20
> BETTER OH THEY MAY NOTKNOW THE SPICIFICS OF OUR TECHNOLOGY BUT  THEY =
CHOULD=20
> KNOW THAT WE ARE VERY RESOURCFUL ENOUGH TO FIND A WAY TO READ THE =
BOOKS THAT=20
> WE WANT TO READ. I WILL NEVER BE AMEMBER OF AN ORGANIZATION THAT =
CHOOSES TO=20
> ENGAGE IN VERY DISCRIMINATIVE PRACTICES AND WHEN THEY SAY THATTHEY =
FIGHT FOR=20
> THE RIGHTS OF ALL HAM OPPERATORS THAT IS NOT QUITE TRUE WHAT THEY =
REALLY=20
> MEAN IS THAT IF YOUR SIGHTED THEN THEY WILL FIGHT FOR YOU BUT IF YOUR 
> =
BLIND=20
> THAN THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU.  I USE TO GET QST FROM NLS BUT I DID =
NOT=20
> LIKE THE FACTTHAT I DID NOT GET THE ENTIRE TEXT OF THE PRINT ADDITION 
> =
I MAY=20
> BE WILL TO PAY FOR AN ACCESSABLE VERSION BUT NOT FULL PRICE BECAUSE I 
> =
WILL=20
> NOT BE ABLE TO SEE THE PHOTOS AND DIAGRAMS SO THE BLIND CHOULD BE =
GIVEN A=20
> DISCOUNT ON THE PRICE OF QST I WOULD RATHER PAY FOR QST IF I COULD GET 
> =
THE=20
> ENTIRE TEXT OF THE PRINT ADDITION INSTEAD OF THE FREE VERSION FROM NLS 
> =
THAT=20
> QUITE LIMITED.  I AM NOT A BIG FAND OF THE ARRL IF THEY EVER GET THEIR 
> =
ACT=20
> TOGETHER THEN AND ONLY THEN WILL I THINK ABOUT JOINING THEM BUT FOR =
NOW NO=20
> TNX.  JUST SOME THOUGHTS FROM N8MNX 73
>=20
> -----Original Message-----=20
> From: Howard, W A 9 Y B W
> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 2:31 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Digital QST And Accessibility
>=20
> Hi,
>=20
> Does anyone have any idea how many blind or visually impaired hams =
there are
> and how many are ARRL members?
>=20
> While this sounds drastic, should we consider a class action law suit 
>=
if we
> could find an attorney who would pursue this.
>=20
> It seems it would be easier to fix this up-front rather than fix it =
later.
>=20
> Just my thoughts.
>=20
> 73's
>=20
> Howard #3
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----=20
> From: "Buddy Brannan" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:33 PM
> Subject: Digital QST And Accessibility
>=20
>=20
>> Hi,
>>=20
>> A fellow blind ham apparently spoke to someone at HQ recently to ask 
>>=
=3D
>> about the upcoming digital edition of QST. The person he spoke to =
seemed =3D
>> to indicate, according to Scott, that not only was the digital =
edition =3D
>> of QST not going to be accessible, but there were no plans to make it 
>> =
=3D
>> accessible.=3D20
>>=20
>> Needless to say, this is disappointing, if true.=3D20
>>=20
>> However, it's possible that there is a misunderstanding of the issues 
>>=
=3D
>> involved here. We of course don't want a special edition, or =
something =3D
>> like that. However, it seems to me that an online edition of QST =
could =3D
>> be inherently usable by blind members. There are, of course, formats 
>> =
=3D
>> that just don't work well (or at all) with screen access technology. 
>> =
The =3D
>> system that CQ Communications has chosen to implement, for instance, 
>> =
=3D
>> can't be used by screen readers. Your standard garden variety PDF, 
>> =3D however, will read with most screen readers, assuming that the 
>> PDF =
isn't =3D
>> solely an image scan of a paper document.=3D20
>>=20
>> I would be interested to know what digital format the ARRL will be =
using =3D
>> for its electronic distribution. Knowing this will help determine =3D 
>> whether or not I will be able to read it when it becomes =
available.=3D20
>>=20
>> While I wasn't on the call that I mentioned, I can tell you that my 
>>=3D=

>> friend felt as though he was not valued as a member in good standing, 
>> =
=3D
>> that his membership was somehow less important because of his =3D 
>> disability, perhaps that he was asking for something unreasonable. =
Bear =3D
>> in mind that, while we do get QST on tape from the Library of =
Congress, =3D
>> the issue comes about two months after the general public gets it. I, 
>> =
=3D
>> for one, would be willing to pay full freight for a membership that 
>> =3D=

>> included a timely and accessible version of QST. However, if my =3D 
>> membership as a blind ham is of no value to the League, perhaps i =
should =3D
>> rethink that. Note that I have no reason yet to believe that this is 
>> =
the =3D
>> case, but one of the staff's members has certainly left at least one 
>> =
=3D
>> member with this impression, not by the possible inaccessibility of =
the =3D
>> digital edition, but rather by the way the issue was handled. Or, =3D  
>>rather, blown off.=3D20
>>=20
>> I would love to discuss this further. We can start with what format =
the =3D
>> digital edition will take and go from there.=3D20
>>=20
>> While I must admit to some disappointment that accessibility wasn't =
even =3D
>> considered when the decision was made to go digital, and, to my =3D  
>>knowledge, no blind members were contacted to get any input on the =3D  
>>issue, I would like to believe that this is something that can be =3D  
>>considered now. Better late than never.
>>=20
>> Vy 73,
>> --
>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY=20