Hi Dorris and Everyone,
Glad you are back on the list.
Do any of you know if there is a downloadable text version of the amplified
bible on the net? I wouldn't know how to find it.
Vinny
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chipmunks" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2006 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: READING AND RESPONDING TO DIFFERENT TRANSLATIONS OF THE BIBLE
> Oh, yeh, I know the difference. They exist in both my languages.
>
> When looking for a strictly easy to read version, I might turn to
> something like the NIRV (New International Reader's Version) rather than a
> paraphrase.
>
> I've heard differing opinions on one English version I like also: The Good
> News Bible (Today's English Version). Some consider it a modern
> translation while some people have denounced it as a paraphrase.
>
> We used the Good News bible in my church's youth group 20 years ago and
> some of my more conservative friends chewed me out because of this.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Doris At 02:08 PM 7/7/2006 -0400, you wrote:
>
>>Dory, as long as you know the difference between a paraphrase and a
>>translation, that's ok. A paraphrase is sort of like a commentary.
>>
>>earlier, Chipmunks, wrote:
>>>Hi, John,
>>>
>>>i agree with you on the translation vs. paraphrase issue wholeheartedly.
>>>
>>>I knew someone who couldn't even differentiate between the paraphrased
>>>Bible text in their version and the commentary notes the author had
>>>added.
>>>
>>>I use a paraphrase occasionally myself for easy reading but always
>>>together with at least one other traditional translation. I also like to
>>>have a more modern translation along when I enjoy the KJV. <g>
>>>
>>>AS for the TNIV, I have a copy flying around here somewhere but I have
>>>not studied it enough to form any opinion on it. I know that the TNIV
>>>uses inclusive language. this by itself would not be enough for me to
>>>reject a translation as I think this is something reflecting changes in
>>>language usage and allso the audience and their culture it addresses
>>>rather than a theological question. I am not sure I understand the
>>>reference to "neutering God" as regards to the TNIB. The NRSV, which is
>>>the translation I prefer to use, does use some inclusive language as it
>>>renders the more traditional "Brethren" as "Brothers and Sisters," for
>>>example but from the way I read it, it takes away nothing from God.
>>>
>>>I had forgotten you were on this list also, John. It's nice to see
>>>familiar names. :-)
>>>
>>>Take care ...
>>>
>>>Doris
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>At 06:55 AM 7/7/2006 -0400, you wrote:
>>>
>>>>John,
>>>>I agree with you here. I get so frustrated when people bring the Living
>>>>Bible to bible study and think that they are handling a translation, or
>>>>worse yet, think that their's no big deal in using it for study. You
>>>>can't do serious study on someone else's opinions of what the word says!
>>>>By the way, while I like the NIV, I understand that the New American
>>>>Standard supposedly is a more accurate translation and I'm not crazy at
>>>>all about the TNIV, which has attempted to neuter God. That is going
>>>>too far for me, for sure.
>>>>Kathy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>At 05:05 PM 7/6/2006, you wrote:
>>>>>Dory, I am not a King James only but call myself a King James mainly.
>>>>>The problem that I have with modern translations is that many people do
>>>>>not differentiate between a translation and a paraphrase. When getting
>>>>>into a paraphrase, you are getting somebody's opinion and not a good
>>>>>translation of the languages. Although I don't think the KJV is
>>>>>inspired, the King James only crowd makes some good points in favor of
>>>>>the KJV.
>>>>>
>>>>>earlier, Chipmunks, wrote:
>>>>>>Oh, I have known and used Theophilos for several years and appreciate
>>>>>>its accessibility.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>i just mentioned E-Sword because it comes with several free modern
>>>>>>Bible Translations .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Doris
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>At 09:39 AM 7/6/2006 -0600, you wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Doris,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I dont' know much about e-sward, but i use Theophilos. The KJV and
>>>>>>>some older translations are free, and then you can purchase packages
>>>>>>>to get newer translations as well as Bible comentaries and
>>>>>>>dictionaries. I think this program has been mentioned on the list
>>>>>>>before, but it's good. The site is
>>>>>>>http://www.theophilos.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>JulieMelton
>>>>>>>visit me at
>>>>>>>www.heart-and-music.com
>>>>>>>Keep smiling!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>From: Chipmunks <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>Reply-To: The Electronic Church <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: READING AND RESPONDING TO DIFFERENT TRANSLATIONS OF THE
>>>>>>>>BIBLE
>>>>>>>>Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2006 12:02:23 +0200
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I take it the AV is the equivalent of the KJV? Over the years since
>>>>>>>>becoming a Christian, I have encountered many individuals who
>>>>>>>>preferred the KJV bible and several who actually think it to be the
>>>>>>>>only inspired bible version. My husband and I once even encountered
>>>>>>>>a Bible college who had "Sole Scriptua, sole KJV" as the motto they
>>>>>>>>wentby.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Being a non-native speaker of English originally, I grew up without
>>>>>>>>any tradition of any particular Bible version. I cannot subscribbe
>>>>>>>>to any doctrine of the KJV being the only inspired bible translation
>>>>>>>>for the simple fact that there are hundreds of bible translations in
>>>>>>>>other languages besides English and I think they are as valid as any
>>>>>>>>English translation and this very fact already prooves to methat
>>>>>>>>there cannot be just one legitimate Bible version or translation.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>After devouring a good part of the Old Testament of a German bible
>>>>>>>>as a second grader before becoming bored with the repitition of
>>>>>>>>Chronicles after The Books of Samuel and Kings, my first encounter
>>>>>>>>with the Bible as a young adult was actually with the KJV. I had
>>>>>>>>heard that the KJV used language very similar to Shakespearean
>>>>>>>>English, which I loved,and i originally set out to read the bible as
>>>>>>>>literature for the beauty of its language. I first met the Messiah
>>>>>>>>in passages from Psalms and the Prophets and in KJV English.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>When I started reading for meaning and content, I found the KJV
>>>>>>>>fairly archaic and hard to understand.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I started reading more modern translations. I have always enjoyed
>>>>>>>>working with different translations and comparing them. I find this
>>>>>>>>very enriching and the next best thing to being able to read the
>>>>>>>>bible in the original Greek and Hebrew. the church I attended as a
>>>>>>>>young Christian encouraged the use of multiple bible translations
>>>>>>>>and I much enjoyed our weekly bible studies where people brought
>>>>>>>>their preferred trnaslation and we took turns reading passages. It
>>>>>>>>was enriching to compare versions at times.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I did over time adopt a translation that I used the most and as
>>>>>>>>Carol said, when I remember verses or passages, the wording is that
>>>>>>>>of my preferred translation usually, but I maintain my interest and
>>>>>>>>enjoyment of multiple translations.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>When discussing the validity of the use of modern translations in
>>>>>>>>contemporary English over the traditional translation of the KJV, i
>>>>>>>>think it is important to remember that the Scriptures in the
>>>>>>>>original languages, especially the New Testament, were not written
>>>>>>>>in any one particular literary style. the old Testament is a library
>>>>>>>>of many different styles of literature, ranging from the beautiful
>>>>>>>>poetry of the PPsalms in the Jewish Hymanal to the historical
>>>>>>>>accounts of the Jewish Scriptures. The New Testament was not written
>>>>>>>>in Classical lliterary Greek but in the colloquial Greek that Jesus
>>>>>>>>contemporaries spoke, many of which were non-native speakers of
>>>>>>>>Greek, as were the majority of the New Testament authors.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I find the variety of translations refreshing and enriching and
>>>>>>>>think it is most important to prayerfully consider which translation
>>>>>>>>works best for the individual to receive God's work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Anyone intersted in studying multiple tramslations of the Bible
>>>>>>>>might want to have a look at the free E-Sword Bible package
>>>>>>>>available from
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>www.e-sword.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>While not that easily accessible, the latest version of E-Sword
>>>>>>>>works well enough with speech to permit reading of different Bible
>>>>>>>>versions. Unfortuantely I find that the notes and commentaries
>>>>>>>>remain inaccessible to me. If anyone on here has found jaws scripts
>>>>>>>>for E-Sword or come up with a way to access all the material and
>>>>>>>>resources in the program, i would be grateful for a pointer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Doris
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>At 09:54 AM 7/6/2006 +0100, you wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Hi there Sharon, and all,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Hmmm! I have been thinking over the past hour or two, since seeing
>>>>>>>>>your message . . .. (I've taken the liberty of changing the
>>>>>>>>>subject header here because some may find that "upgrading" thought
>>>>>>>>>a little tackey.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>First, in full defence of the AV, I am very prepared to agree its
>>>>>>>>>outstanding accuracy and truthfulness and the need for this in the
>>>>>>>>>Church. I know and respect those who feel so passionately they
>>>>>>>>>wouldn't use anything else! (I even know some on this list and I
>>>>>>>>>reckon they won't keep quiet for too long <SMILE>!)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>For me, I grew up with the AV and learned and got to know its
>>>>>>>>>wording so well that, if I am imprisoned or without a Bible in
>>>>>>>>>later years, I know these are the words I will be crying out!
>>>>>>>>>Therefore, there is something very special for me about the AV.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>However, alongside this, I do find its archaic, old English
>>>>>>>>>language both a bit sweet and treakley and certainly it's something
>>>>>>>>>which I do not fully understand or identify with. For example, I
>>>>>>>>>even find 1 Corinthians 13 causes me to feel I'm being called
>>>>>>>>>(though not drawn) to the litergy of the church and not the real
>>>>>>>>>meaning of the passage on occasions, especially when this is
>>>>>>>>>delivered in a large church with a lot of echo, and for me there
>>>>>>>>>are far better, more modern, translations of that lovely passage.
>>>>>>>>>It is for this reason that I still read the old but also more
>>>>>>>>>modern translations and allow God to speak with me and refresh me
>>>>>>>>>as I do so!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Your example in Luke 7 is so right, to my mind. "Cry" and "weep"
>>>>>>>>>are words I understand and appreciate, and even think there is a
>>>>>>>>>difference between them, and that comment is based on my own
>>>>>>>>>experience. Why say something more when these words are adequate!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I don't want to say too much about individual versions, but I do
>>>>>>>>>keep a copy of the NIV around on my BrailleNote because it sort of
>>>>>>>>>is the general version I can keep with me. I love, love the
>>>>>>>>>Amplified, when I want to think some more about words! There are
>>>>>>>>>some very refreshing things about The Message Bible also. In some
>>>>>>>>>ways its language gets me a bit hot under the collar (perhaps it's
>>>>>>>>>a little over the top in some of its "American expression" for us
>>>>>>>>>Britts) but in others I find it refreshing. It seems to move on a
>>>>>>>>>pace that cannot be conveyed to me as I read the AV. I think you
>>>>>>>>>would like to read the Message and maybe you already have it. (The
>>>>>>>>>Message also uses the word "cry" in that passage, by the way,
>>>>>>>>>Sharon.)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Finally, here's one further thought which I want to convey and it's
>>>>>>>>>meant by no means to take away any of the truth and reverence of
>>>>>>>>>the older versions of the Bible. My thinking goes something like
>>>>>>>>>this: "Well, Jesus expresses Himself to us in ways we can
>>>>>>>>>understand. He meets us where we are. He speaks words in the
>>>>>>>>>church which often are brought by younger, enthusiastic ones whose
>>>>>>>>>language understanding and presentation is more like the Message
>>>>>>>>>than the AV. So be it! God will still speak His truth into hungry
>>>>>>>>>hearts! God will still make His ways known! I personally don't
>>>>>>>>>want to examine every word etc for its accuracy either, because I'm
>>>>>>>>>not that kind of scholar, but I do want to be blessed inside as I
>>>>>>>>>read His word!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Anyway, I'm off my soap box now. Have been up many hours so guess
>>>>>>>>>it's brunchtime for me!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>>Carol
>>>>>>>>>[log in to unmask]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon Hooley"
>>>>>>>>><[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>>To: <[log in to unmask]>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2006 7:27 AM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: Upgrading Versions of the bible?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Well Julie, of course the Bible doesn't change, but our
>>>>>>>>>>understanding of some things in the bible can change as we grow in
>>>>>>>>>>the Lord, and maybe it's possible to "upgrade" as far as
>>>>>>>>>>contemporary language is concerned, not to change the meaning of
>>>>>>>>>>what the Bible says, but to speak our everyday language.
>>>>>>>>>>Unfortunately, many of those who create a new translation tend to
>>>>>>>>>>try to make the bible say what they want it to say, instead of
>>>>>>>>>>what it's really saying. Personally, I want my bible to speak the
>>>>>>>>>>language I use, not the ancient language of the KJV, as long as
>>>>>>>>>>the modern translation is accurate. From the bible, I wish I
>>>>>>>>>>could hear things like, "Serving God is so much fun! So cool!"
>>>>>>>>>>But I need to remind myself that, even if I read it in an ancient
>>>>>>>>>>language, it can be just as expressive as we are today. For
>>>>>>>>>>example, there's the story about when Jesus approached a funeral
>>>>>>>>>>procession. His hart went out to the widow who had just lost her
>>>>>>>>>>son. In the KJV, we read, "Weep not." But in the NIV, (which may
>>>>>>>>>>not be a perfectly accurate translation), we hear Him simply
>>>>>>>>>>saying, "Don't cry." I would rather hear the latter, but maybe,
>>>>>>>>>>just maybe, Jesus is depicted just as strongly compassionate,
>>>>>>>>>>affectionate and comforting, in the KJV. What are your thoughts?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Sharon
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>>>>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>>No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>>>>>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>--
>>>>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>--
>>>>>>No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>>>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date:
>>>>>>7/4/2006
>>>>>
>>>>>John
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006
>>>
>>>
>>>--
>>>No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.9/382 - Release Date: 7/4/2006
>>>
>>
>>John
>>
>>
>>
>>--
>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.10/383 - Release Date: 7/7/2006
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>--
>>No virus found in this incoming message.
>>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.10/383 - Release Date: 7/7/2006
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.10/383 - Release Date: 7/7/2006
>
>
|
