Well I never!

The impression I’ve got is that you’ve dismissed everything I said. Oh, 
that’s made feel bad for a while, but ok, it’s over now. 

Indeed I’ve found your post rather too aggressive, or to put in 
one “useful descriptive term”: it was rather "gross". I wonder if that was 
your hidden agenda: to push me away. A point for you: I’m leaving, but for 
a different reason (please see my next e-mail).

But I know, I know: this is a list for giving support and exchanging 
information, not for displaying manners. (I’m sorry, David.) Anyway I 
can't keep my big mouth shut.

Actually, I wasn’t assuming anything about you. I was just politely 
offering another word for your consideration. If I’ve stepped on your 
toes, I’m sorry. Certainly, it seems, you’ve missed my raw finesse and 
sense of humo(u)r. But don’t worry. That wasn’t too serious.

While I don’t mean to tell you what to do like Emily Post, because I 
presume that you, just like me, weren’t born yesterday and moreover 
because you appear to be such a savvy and self-assured person, I suggest 
you take this small piece of advice, if appropriate:

Next time around tread on us more gently. And you’ll be heard with 
pleasure a second time.

JC

...........................................................................
On Tue, 28 Feb 2006 14:37:21 -0500, Aria Nadii <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Jose Carlos wrote:
>
>>Good points, Aria.
>>
>>So, I agree with you in that it's all about cultural conditioning,
>>and not really a gender issue. However, on second thoughts, I am not sure
>>if you can talk simply about cultural conditioning here. When you use the
>>word "conditioning", it seems you have something less than desirable in
>>your mind, like brainwashing.
>>
>Your second thoughts are your own imagination running away
>with you perhaps. I think you are reading too much into my use
>of the term conditioning or perhaps "projecting" if I dare to use
>another word that seems to be a button pusher. ;)
>
>Never assume what I have in my mind. It usually isn't typical.
>
>I placed no judgement on the word "conditioning". I stated it as a
>simple term with no unsavory or negative connotations. This is not
>a negative word to me. It's just a useful descriptive term.
>
>Really, my only point is that I didn't think it was a "female" thing.
>
>
>> Actually, all cultures on the earth rely on
>>some degree of conditioning, for survival. It may be silly, 
unjustifiable,
>>absurd, but conditioning is unavoidable. Well, maybe I'm trying to gild
>>the pill, but I'd rather call conditioning traditions, because then it
>>sounds a lot better. And I feel relieved.
>>
>>Then I'd say: we normally don't eat raw meat, because it is no longer a
>>tradition. Tradition actually comes from "trahere", which is the Latin
>>word for "to drag, to bring something from somewhere".
>>
>>At the same time, you know, every tradition admits certain raw animal
>>foods, except maybe the Jewish tradition, which leans towards
>>vegetarianism. I don't know what they think about raw milk, milk not 
being
>>paleo anyway.
>>
>>
>I am aware of all this. I come from a tradition that includes raw meat.
>I can't
>honestly say I've run into any Americans who don't think of my diet as 
weird
>and gross. Cultural conditioning surely factors into that, since logic
>doesn't
>apply.
>
>For example, I know so many Americans who would think nothing of eating
>Caesar salad (which contains raw egg) or Steak Tartar (which is very
>similar
>to my native kibbe nayeh) or sausages (very similar to haggis) and yet 
find
>those foods in parentheses to be weird or gross or dangerous..
>
>I do actually have a friend who vapors at my raw egg condiments and yet
>loves egg nog and Caesar salad. No logic applies. It's just what you are
>used to and what you grow up being told. People scream at me about
>salmonella, which as far as I know most people get from salad bars not
>raw eggs. Where does that come from? Conditioning.
>
>>Anyway, I'm glad to hear that you're the bravest one in your household in
>>terms of eating the raw stuff.
>>
>>
>It isn't bravery at all, which brings us back around to the word
>"conditioning' again and shows us that it is a useful term and not
>inappropriate. I've been eating these things since I was a kid. They
>are as ordinary to me as hot dogs and apple pie are to some people.
>I am conditioned to these things from childhood as fine and safe and
>tasty. Beyond that, I have conditioned myself to what I feel is natural
>for my health and body.
>
>    Aria
>=========================================================================