On Mon, 15 Dec 1997, sbmarcus wrote:

> To be fair to Lyotard and Ken: The above are not buzzwords, in the sense
> that buzzwords, as the term seems to be used in contemporary political
> discourse, are intended as a shorthand vocabulary to evoke an emotional
> response of either threat or comfort by replacing any serious discussion
> with an uncomplex and ill-defined signifier.

Granted.  And indeed, I had less trouble understanding the example Ken
provided than I do understanding much contemporary political rhetoric.
However, the original was written either for a very specific audience or
intended to be humorous, and I suspect the latter.

> You'd have to be a pretty special person for the phrase "Polytheism of
> values in postmodern discourse"  to come across to you as an uncomplex and
> ill-defined signifier.  It is part of a legitimate effort within a
> discipline to put into words what are very complex ideas.

I agree that efforts to put complexity into words often sound ridiculous
to outsiders, but the expression in quotes *is* ill-defined.  For example,
I have discovered that outside of the specifically architectural context,
there does not seem to be any consensus on the definition of "postmodern".
There is no surer way to provoke an argument in a crowd of three or more
assorted academics than to request this definition.  I think this is not
because "postmodern" is a complex idea but because it is so ill-defined
that everyone has been able choose a different understanding.

And what function does the word "discourse" have here?  Discourse may
involve the expression of values, or expression that is founded in values,
but the values are an attribute of the individuals, not of the discourse.

> Try describing the elements of an architectural structure to a lay-person
> sometime without using any terms that require a knowledge of the subject.
> Good luck.

Oh, I'm well aware of this.  A few years ago, a newly appointed member of
our historic district commission asked what a "gable" was.  We all rolled
our eyes, but at least he was willing to ask questions and learn.  Still,
try describing even a simple house to someone for whom "gable" is
inexplicable architectural jargon.

                              Larry Kestenbaum